Chuck Shute Podcast
In depth interviews with musicians, comedians, authors, actors, and more! Guests on the show include David Duchovny, Billy Bob Thornton, Mark Normand, Dee Snider, Ann Wilson, Tony Horton, Don Dokken, Jack Carr and many more.
Chuck Shute Podcast
Melissa Urban (The Whole 30 Founder)
Melissa Urban is the co-founder and CEO of Whole30, and a six-time New York Times best-selling author. She is the host of the Do the Thing podcast, and is a prominent keynote speaker on social media and branding, health trends, and entrepreneurship. Her latest book "The New Whole 30" is an updated version of her famous Whole 30 book. We discuss the new book, ultra-processed foods, organic vs non-organic foods, Ozempic, food influencers and more!
0:00:00 - Intro
0:00:12 - Checking In
0:00:42 - Melissa's Concussion
0:04:05 - Eating Natural Foods & Healing
0:05:30 - The Whole 30 Overview
0:08:23 - Ultra-Processed Foods
0:12:08 - Taste & Food Production
0:14:50 - Organic Vs. Non-Organic
0:16:30 - Seed Oils & Healthy Oils
0:18:55 - Whole 30 Meals at Costco
0:20:50 - Using Salt & Sweetener in Food
0:23:33 - Soy & Vegan Whole 30
0:26:50 - Dairy & Raw Milk
0:29:25 - Pancake Rule
0:31:45 - Weight Loss & Being Healthy
0:34:10 - Ozempic & Weight Loss Drugs
0:36:55 - Finding the Why for Whole 30
0:38:40 - Setting Boundaries & Alcohol
0:42:18 - Whole 30 & Health Lifestyle
0:44:20 - Whole 30 Testimonials
0:45:20 - Carnivore Diet
0:48:25 - Different Cooking Methods
0:50:55 - Fish - Wild Vs. Farmed
0:54:55 - New Recipes
0:56:20 - Food Influencers
0:58:15 - Influencing Food Companies & Individuals
1:01:14 - Outro
Melissa Urban website:
https://www.melissau.com/
Chuck Shute link tree:
https://linktr.ee/chuck_shute
Thanks for Listening & Shute for the Moon!
Hi, Melissa, welcome back.
Melissa Urban:Chuck. It's good to see you. How are you?
Chuck Shute:Good. How are you?
Melissa Urban:I'm doing great. Thanks. I was so excited to get back on your calendar.
Chuck Shute:Oh, yeah. I'm excited to have you. I'm honored that you reached out and your publicist that I was like, Oh, wow, she remembers me. And of
Melissa Urban:course they do. We had such a great conversation around boundaries. And then I feel like we've been able to kind of keep on top in touch on social. So yeah, this is gonna be really fun. Yeah, you're
Chuck Shute:doing some great stuff on the socials. I'm learning a lot. I think one of the things I learned, I just recently learned about you had this concussion. How are you doing? Oh,
Melissa Urban:yeah. Oh, it's like truly right now. It's so bad. But that's okay. Yeah, it you know, I had two years or so I have like, really serious symptoms until my physical therapist and I kind of figured out some of what was going on. And I was able to do more targeted physical therapy. But if I travel a lot, or have a lot of events, I or if I get sick, I will get flares. Like any kind of like a chronic illness flare, I guess. But I was in Costco stores for the last two weekends in a row with our new marinated chicken doing like events at those stores. And it's like the fluorescent lights and people and I'm talking for like eight hours a day straight. And then I had flights to and from Atlanta that landed at like 11 o'clock at night both ends. And so I just have been like, absolutely wrecked by that. So I'm really happy to have a long weekend coming up or I can just like relax and chill. And yeah, but it's
Chuck Shute:because I saw the one video online where they they like showed your brain scan. Have you? Have you had a recent brain scan? Has there been improvement? Or?
Melissa Urban:No, I probably won't get another one. I know it's healing because my flares are less severe. And they're, and they happen less often. And then I'm able to recover faster, especially if I can rest. But, you know, it's getting it's definitely getting way better. But I just still pops up now. And again. It's just one of those things where I still have some triggers. And I think because it's so hard for me to truly rest. You know, like I can't always take a week off and not have any screen time. So it's just something that I you know, deal with. It's fine. It's,
Chuck Shute:yeah, it's interesting. My dad, he fell off a ladder and he's in his 70s and he hit his head and he had a brain bleed. And so they put them on these like pharmaceuticals and and I feel like the pharmaceuticals he says they made them worse. He was walking with a cane. I was like really worried about him. She didn't say this. This is crazy. My dad's like very conservative, very anti drug. He started micro dosing mushrooms. Yes. Weirdest thing. For my dad. I mean, this is a person on earth that you would picture doing something like this. And he swears by he said it he the people at the doctor's office, they put them on this antiseizure stuff and they said, if you stop taking this, you could have a seizure. You know, that's all these bad things are gonna happen. Yada yada yada. Well, he took the micro dosing mushrooms, he went back into brain scan, they showed no signs of a brain bleed. He they said that was unheard of the doctors were baffled. They said they it usually takes at least a year to heal. And he's, it's been years now and he's had no issues. That's amazing.
Melissa Urban:There's a really cool clinical trial going on in Canada right now with micro dosing mushrooms for TBI, and like post concussion syndrome. So it's they're studying it, there's some just there's really interesting kind of cutting edge research. And I'm lucky that I have a fantastic physical therapist out of Park City Hospital, who's also been doing some cutting edge research with it. So I have a really good team. But it's just one of those things where like, they don't know a lot about concussion, particularly in women, because most of the studies have been done with men and women are not just small men. And I think we're really starting to understand the long term implications. And you know, what, you have to do post concussion to really limit your symptoms, none of which I did, because I had no idea. So, yeah, anyway, it's been a journey, that's for sure.
Chuck Shute:That's crazy. Well, it's just interesting, just the whole you know, it seems like there's this this push now for more natural healing. And I mean, that's kind of what the whole 30 is all about, to me is like healing yourself with food and cutting out some of the chemicals. I mean, obviously you can't cut out every chemical because chemicals everywhere, but you know, cutting down on some things and eating more real food and I think that's a great thing that you're doing with that. Yes,
Melissa Urban:you know, I'm always really careful not to overstate it diet doesn't fix everything, right. It's not like changing your diet can automatically I have a lot of women who come to me who are you know, my agent in perimenopause, and they're like with the whole 30 You know, eliminate my my pre menopausal symptoms and it's like, well, you know, menopause is a very natural biological process and there may be symptoms with that and so, you know, we're not going to cure menopause. But yes, dietary changes can have a really big impact on symptoms of you know, everyday conditions like aches and pains and headaches and allergies and out Asthma, they can certainly play a huge role in conditions for which your doctor might want you to take medication like high cholesterol, or high blood pressure or regular anti inflammatories. And yes, we've had a lot of women say they have been very that the whole 30 has been very helpful with their pre menopausal and menopausal symptoms like hot flashes and brain fog. So yeah, diet can be very powerful.
Chuck Shute:Yeah, and a lot of people, they might not even know how good they can feel unless they try this whole 30 diet. And you really, it's you got to stick with it, though, for 30 days, because the first week or two is it's tough.
Melissa Urban:Yes. Can I give people a brief overview of what whole 30 is? Yeah. Okay, so whole 30 is an elimination and reintroduction program. So it's not a prescriptive diet, we're not saying this is how you should eat forever. It's not a weight loss program. It's not a Detox or Cleanse. The goal of the whole 30 is to identify hidden food sensitivities, some of the foods that you are eating, that you may even consider healthy, that you may have a sensitivity to that or having a negative impact on your energy, sleep, mood, digestion, cravings, aches and pains all of those things we just talked about. So for the first 30 days, yes, you eliminate foods that the scientific literature and our clinical experience have shown can be problematic to varying degrees across a broad range of people. And you pull all of those foods out of your diet for 30 days strictly, because the framework of an elimination diet does require you to very strictly eliminate, and you see what happens in the absence of these foods. Does your energy improve? Do you start sleeping better? Do your cravings diminish? Is your digestion smoother? Are you less bloated? Can you focus better is your attention span better? Are your joints less swollen and inflamed? Does that old tendinitis pain go away allergies, asthma, eczema, migraines, anxiety, all of those things can be influenced by your diet. At the end of the 30 days, you reintroduce those food groups one at a time very carefully and systematically and compare your experience. So by the end of the whole 30, you will have a blueprint for the foods that work best in your unique system. And you'll be able to take that information to craft your own sustainable joyful diet long term.
Chuck Shute:Yeah, I love that. Because that's the thing is like you You hear all these things online or influencers or whatever. And you say this study says dairy is bad. This study says the whole grains are bad. But it's like you don't really know until you test it on yourself. Yes,
Melissa Urban:right. You know, every dietitian that you'll talk to will say the same thing. There is no one size fits all, when it comes to diet, you have to figure out what works for you. And people say, Yeah, that makes sense. Okay, how do I figure out what works for me? And well, 30 really is the answer to how, because grains have lots of health promoting properties. And for you, they may be a wonderful addition in terms of fiber and micro nutrition and energy. And for other people, they feel worse when they eat gluten containing grains that impacts their digestion or their skin, or their symptoms. And until you figure out how these foods work for you, you won't know the best diet for you long term. So we provide you with a short term framework to figure that out. And then we leave you and say, take what you've learned and create your own sustainable what we call food freedom plan where no foods are off limits, and you decide what is and isn't worth it for your life.
Chuck Shute:Yeah, and don't you think I don't you posted a clip about this the other day, about Ultra processed foods, that's kind of the new buzzword I just had a guy on who worked with the FDA and nutrition and he was bringing up the study where they had two groups one people they ate Ultra processed foods and one ate real foods. And that was the same nutrients but the people on the ultra processed diet, they ate more they five hours more a day when it was given the same kind of nutrients. So it does make you think that that could be part of the reason that we're so unhealthy is reading these ultra processed foods, which may have some weird chemicals, but also they have these chemicals that make us eat more of them. And that's why we're getting sick.
Melissa Urban:Yeah, we I call these foods with no breaks. They're the foods that once you start eating, they're really hard to stop eating because they don't contain or they've been stripped of a lot of their natural satiety factors. So protein, fat, fiber, micro nutrition, all of those things that you find in real Whole Foods, that when you eat them, they send signals from your gut to your brain to say, Okay, we're full, we've got enough nutrition, you can stop eating now. But when you're talking about foods like potato chips, all of that stuff has been stripped out, the calories have been concentrated and they're more bioavailable, and you don't have those natural breaks to tell you to stop eating. And then of course these foods are designed to be salty, and crunchy, and fatty and sweet. All of those things that really light up our tastebuds. So they're designed to make us over consume and once we start eating them, they can be very hard to stop eating. And then that can you know, obviously there are physical consequences that can come when you're over eating these foods. But also for a lot of people it leads to a lot of emotional you know, negative self talk and guilt and shame and stress. And that can promote this really unhealthy cycle where you eat these foods for comfort or stress management, and then you feel guilty about it. And you talk badly of yourself and it hurts your self confidence. And that creates stress. And that same stress leads you right back to those foods to comfort yourself. So, whole 30 really does aim to break that cycle by not only addressing the foods that you're eating, but also your habits and your emotional relationship with food. Definitely,
Chuck Shute:yeah, have you heard of that book, the Dorito effect where they talk about some of this, how they design these Doritos and, and I haven't gone down this rabbit hole. But I've heard something about like the people that worked for the tobacco companies that helped make cigarettes more addictive, moved on to the food companies and tried to make the foods more addictive.
Melissa Urban:Yeah, they did do some some good consulting in that area, too. I've read salt, sugar, fat by Michael Moss, that was a really good one. And then an old school book that talks about this as the Power of Habit by Charles Duhigg. He talks about sort of that habit loop and some of the ways that these foods are super normally stimulating. But yes, you know, food scientists design them in a very specific way. And then they are marketed to us in a very specific way. Right? If you break up with your boyfriend, you should grab a pint of ice cream. If you had a hard day of parenting especially directed at moms, you need that, you know, glass of wine at night, it's there's so much societally built into why we choose and eat these ultra processed foods. And I'm not saying they're bad by any means. I don't think there are any good or bad foods universally. But when over consumed, especially in the context of other lifestyle factors, like not enough sleep, not enough healthy movement, chronic stress that can really all add up.
Chuck Shute:Yeah, no, I agree. And I think the first step is just acknowledging, too, that these foods are delicious. I mean, this this junk food is it is designed to taste good. So it's okay to go. I really liked that like, oh, maybe there's something wrong with me. No, you're a normal human. It's, you're you're meant to like these foods. Yeah,
Melissa Urban:I mean, of course you are. Yes. I call them like the Las Vegas strip in your mouth. Right. They're exciting. They are, as I said, super normally stimulating and we really liked them. But one of the most interesting benefits of the whole 30 that I don't think a lot of people realize going into it is that once you remove those foods from your diet, even just for 30 days, your taste buds adapt very, very quickly. And so the feedback i'll get by week, two of the program is people will say I never realized how sweet strawberries are, or my sweet potatoes tastes so sweet. Right now, I had a woman at a nutrition seminar who said I used to put Splenda over my fruit, all of my fruit, I would put Splenda on it because it didn't taste sweet enough. And after my whole 30, I realized that these foods are so naturally sweet and delicious. So your taste buds can reset very, very quickly. And then you can really appreciate the natural flavors found in these foods, which I think is a real win.
Chuck Shute:Yeah, that's interesting. My trainer is from Romania. And he said like he would eat apples. Like he's like, Yeah, we had apple trees, like in our backyard. He's like, I taste an apple here in America. It doesn't taste the same. The taste better in Romania tastes, he said it tasted kind of like chemicals. Have you know, you've traveled around? I mean, you're in South Africa. Like, have you noticed? Food is different in other countries?
Melissa Urban:I definitely have. I have a much easier time eating bread and pasta and gluten containing grades in Europe than I do here. But I don't know if that's because of the food itself, or because when I'm in Europe, I'm on vacation, and I'm relaxed. And I'm walking more like it's hard to say there are competing factors. But obviously, you know, we want to mass produced a lot of these foods. And sometimes I think about the way we produce like chicken and how we're making them as big as possible to get as much meat out of them as possible. But how that really hurts the birds. And I would imagine we're doing a lot of the same things to produce. So yeah, that's that's definitely a factor. That
Chuck Shute:is interesting. Like if you watch food incorporated one and two, and like they kind of explained they show how the food is made. I feel like that's one thing that I wish omnivores and carnivores and vegans we can all come together and don't we all want better treatment for the animals. Like I want to if I'm gonna still eat meat, but I want to eat a chicken that was you know, running around in a pasture not cooped up together, you know, and a bunch of chicken poop. Like that's disgusting. Yeah,
Melissa Urban:it is, you know, I really do think it's important to know where your food came from. There are there are similar practices with farming practices to growing of tomatoes or growing up, or picking of strawberries or the farming of bananas or coffee beans or cacao beans. You know, I think it's really important to know where your food is coming from and to learn about some of the factors that go into it. So you can make decisions that are right for you, given your level of financial privilege and access and you know, all of those factors,
Chuck Shute:right and that's one thing that you brought up on your Instagram, when you talked about the Dirty Dozen because there was you know, bring that up every year like these are the 12 fruits and vegetables that are have the most pesticides, but you'd say You know, you're not as worried about that, because for some people, it is an affordability issue. And it's better to eat a strawberry than a Dorito. Right? Even if it's not organic. Yeah,
Melissa Urban:I think there's a lot of fear mongering around food these days. And it very often comes from like wellness or health influencers, where, you know, if you can't do it absolutely the best of the best, it's almost like you're doing something wrong. And the Dirty Dozen is a really good example of that the Environmental Working Group puts out this list of the most heavily pesticide fruits and vegetables. But when you really dig into the data, first of all, that group is supported by a lot of organic farming companies. So there's an incentive to them to want to recommend that people eat organic. And when you dig into the actual level of pesticides, you'd have to eat like 12 buckets of strawberries to even in a single setting to even approximate, you know, a level of pesticide that any reasonable person could be concerned about. And studies have shown that when people are fear monger to around these foods, especially in underrepresented communities, people who live in food deserts, they will read something like the Dirty Dozen and think, Well, I can't afford or I don't have access to that organic produce, I guess I just shouldn't buy strawberries or blueberries. And I'm saying no, no, please like we just want you to eat the vegetables, eat the vegetables, or eat the produce in whatever format you can canned, frozen, fresh from the farmers market, organic, conventional, whatever that looks like and whatever your level of access is. Eating it is better than not eating it hard. Stop.
Chuck Shute:Yeah. What are your thoughts on CBD oils?
Melissa Urban:Yeah, I mean, I think there again, I talk about fear mongering. And I don't think there's any more fear mongering around the concept of seed oils, you will have some of these influencers believe that like if you eat your, you know, vegetables that you grow in your own garden, cooked in canola oil that it's going to strike you Dad, I hear the word toxic thrown around, I hear the word poison thrown around. And I just think that's absolutely ridiculous. The current science does not support the idea that that seed oils are inherently inflammatory. And I've done a big research project into this over the course of the last two years, which I'll be releasing closer to when the book comes out. But that's another example of if the fear of not using the perfect cooking oil, which is like a fermented oil, or an avocado oil, or an extra virgin olive oil, which are all far more expensive in the grocery store. If the fear of not using the right oil is keeping you from cooking at home. To me that you're you're missing the boat on this and I think some of these influencers are doing far more harm than good to the collective of we just want people to eat better and eat more whole foods, cook with whatever oil is available to you and accessible to you. And in the context of you know, cooking real Whole Foods at home. I am not at all concerned about you wanting to use canola or safflower or sunflower oil, flower oil. Yeah.
Chuck Shute:Did you think I mean, I feel like all of oil, I've never heard anybody say anything bad about that one. So
Melissa Urban:there's one thing that everybody agrees on, which is kind of miraculous, which is mono unsaturated fats are heart healthy. No matter what your camp is, everybody kind of gets on board with this idea that mono unsaturated fats are good for your heart and good for your health. And those are found in higher quantities in extra virgin olive oil in avocado oil. But in in in some of these like fermented oils, like zero acre farm has like a fermented oil. So yeah, that's that's one piece of this puzzle. But you'll hear hear people argue back and forth about seed oils about saturated fat, about the role of omega six to omega three fatty acids. And to me, you're sort of losing the forest to the trees, we want people to eat whole food. And we want people to cook at home as much as you can like as much as reasonable that fits into your lifestyle that fits into your budget that fits into your time access. So whatever cooking oil you want to use for that purpose, whatever you can afford, whatever you have access to. That's great. That works for me. Yeah,
Chuck Shute:well then what about so just you know, talking about cooking at home and people on the go, this is exciting. You have these frozen meals at Costco that is I don't know if it's in my Costco. Yeah, but I saw you kind of doing like a tour of this. What is this going on in every city?
Melissa Urban:I hope so. So we just launched they're not frozen, they're fresh or marinated chicken breasts. So we launched them in all of the southeast area Costco stores. So I was just I just spent two weekends in Atlanta doing events with their local Costco stores rolling these out. But essentially, they're just pre cooked, grilled and then Suvi chicken breasts so you know Soviet is that vacuum sealed cooking method where you cook it low and slow in a water bath. And it just makes the meat incredibly tender. And because we serve eat it in its own marinade, the chicken stays very, very juicy and very tender. And then all you have to do they come in packs of six at Costco, which is super convenient. All you have to do is microwave it for three to four minutes or just heat the whole thing up in a skillet for just a couple minutes and the protein part of your meal prep is done. So we're super excited about those. I hope they're going to be in every Costco nationwide. They're brand new. We just rolled them out two weeks ago. Oh, but it's another step in our accessibility efforts, which is helping people who just don't have time to cook meals all the time at home, get that good whole 30 meal in without having to do so much, you know, vegetable prepping and cooking and sorry, cooking and chopping and dishes and stuff. And
Chuck Shute:it's got the nutritional profile of healthy food without
Melissa Urban:I mean, the ingredient list is so short, it's exactly what you would expect of whole 30. It's just chicken, extra virgin olive oil, a little bit of vinegar in the marinade and some spices, there's more than 30 grams of protein per serving. So, you know, pound for pound or ounce for ounce. It's got a lot of protein density, and it's relatively low sodium. I'm not particularly worried about sodium in my diet, but I know a lot of people are. So we tried to craft it. So it would have lower sodium than any other products in the category. Yeah,
Chuck Shute:that is one thing that and that stands from the first whole 30 that you've always said salt as Okay, so what is the salt get a bad rap? Because that's another thing I see it the influencers, say like, no salt is good for you. But you have to have like these, you know, special Himalayan salt or specific kinds of salt. There's bad salt for you, too. Right?
Melissa Urban:Okay, so first of all, again, I think that's silly. I think that's very, very silly. You need sodium in your diet is a necessary electrolyte. And it's, you know, it's one of those things where too little is just as bad as too much. If you have too much for your context, then yes, that can create issues. Obviously, we know too much sodium can be tied to high blood pressure. But if you don't have enough that can cause just as many issues. And I am not particularly afraid of sodium in the context of a whole foods based diet, where I'm very, very active. I live in a very dry climate. You know, outside in summer, I'm hiking 10 or 12 Miles actually supplement with sodium on my electrolyte supplement element electrolytes includes 1000 milligrams of sodium, and I'm taking one or two of those a day to support my activity levels. And that seems to work really, really well for my body. And especially on a whole 30 Because you're eating far fewer processed foods. I want you to make sure that you're salting your food and adding salt to your recipes, so that you aren't eating too little. Yeah,
Chuck Shute:I don't think I have a problem. I get a salt.
Melissa Urban:Yeah. I mean, it's delicious.
Chuck Shute:Yeah, that's great. It makes it and I think yeah, I mean, it's better than Yeah, because that's the ultra process things they sneak a lot of salt in. I mean, just look at the sodium content of any processed food. Look at the nutritional label on the back of any almost any processed food is either loaded with fat sugar, or salt or all three,
Melissa Urban:all three. Yeah, that's how they get you because all that stuff tastes really really good. Yes, of course.
Chuck Shute:So when you cook it yourself, then you know what's in it, and you can you're not going to put that much stuff into I mean, even if you're sweetening, which you know you're not supposed to on a whole 30 But you know, after you finish all three, you can sweet and just with a little bit of honey, I feel like that's way better than the amount of like sugar that goes into some of these foods.
Melissa Urban:Yeah, when I use sweetener in life after my whole 30 It's, I make this soy like teriyaki soy salmon. So I'm using honey and coconut aminos and garlic and these like herbs and I'm, you know, doing a salmon marinade. That's how I use it. Or I'll enjoy a maple chicken sausage in life after the whole 30. Sometimes I use a sweetened creamer, there's nutpods makes a sweetened version in my morning, decaf coffee. So I'm not, you know, I'm using some sugar, but I'm more conscientious about where I'm adding it. And because my taste buds have changed so much. A little bit of sweetness goes a long way for me, which is really nice.
Chuck Shute:Yeah, well, you mentioned soy. So what are your thoughts on soy? Because I don't know, I don't want to give anything away. But there's some changes to this one. And the original soy was off limits. You could do coconut aminos and stuff in place of that. You know, there's all this talk about I remember in the I don't know, it was the 90s. My parents were all about soy like we read soy prevents cancer were and they were eating soy at every meal and all this stuff. And now there's talk that maybe soy is not good. Is it just maybe moderation was soy or what are your thoughts?
Melissa Urban:Yeah, so on the original whole 30 we do eliminate soy for 30 days, because soy is one of the most allergenic foods for people people do tend to be sensitive to it. And you don't need soy for protein on the original whole 30 Because you're eating plenty of animal products. So it gives you the opportunity to pull soy and soy products out for 30 days and then reintroduce it and see how it works for you. So I happens to work really well for me. I love tofu. I love edamame A, so I work them into my protein rotation. So I'm eating some meals that happened to be more plant forward. I do think we were really afraid of soy for a long time and worried that soy was going to be estrogenic it was going to really jack up people's estrogen levels. And again, we have a research project coming out where I will, you know, freely say I don't think that those concerns are necessarily valid and I think they have been highly overblown. I don't know that you would necessarily want to, you know, eat nothing but so Why is your protein source I love the idea of varying but if you tolerate it Well, I think it's a fantastic addition to your protein needs. And especially if you want to have a more plant forward approach on the plant based whole 30, which is new in this book, we rolled it out two years ago, but it's the first time it's appearing in print, you are using soy and other legumes as a protein source because you're not eating any animal protein. It's essentially a vegan version of the whole 30. And soy and legumes are a better source of protein and tend to be less problematic for people than protein from other sources like gluten, grains and other grains. So that's why they're allowed on the plant based whole 30 Because you have to get your protein from somewhere. And so it is a dense source of protein.
Chuck Shute:Would it be possible if you're vegan, and but it also have a soy allergy? That would be tough. Hmm.
Melissa Urban:It'd be really tough, you would have to get your protein solely from legumes and some plant based protein powders, like a pea based protein powder, and maybe some there are a few whole 30 compatible meat alternatives. So Abbott is an example of this. They make Cerrito they make a plant based chicken, they make a plant based ground beef. And it's, it's essentially pea protein. It's very whole food and you know, very natural ingredients. Like they don't have a lot of additives or fillers. It's all sort of Whole Foods. You could supplement with that. But it would be tougher on a plant based whole 30 If you weren't eating any soy at all.
Chuck Shute:Yeah. Well, I don't want to give anything away. If dairy is dairy still eliminated in the book? I don't.
Melissa Urban:I know. I know. Yeah, I'm sorry. I know. So people don't get their hopes up. Like you still can have wine on the whole 30. You still can't have cheese on the whole 30 You still can't have bread, those things haven't changed. Yeah.
Chuck Shute:But I wanted to ask you. Because I mean, I'm eating a lot of dairy right now. I have not gone on to this. I haven't tried this. But this is like the new thing that people are talking about raw milk. And that's a trendy thing. What are your thoughts on that? Because other people will say it's really dangerous. I'm not I'm too scared to try it because I don't want to die. I don't think it's worth the health benefits. But the theory is that whatever the the bacteria that's in raw milk, that helps you digest it. So that's why the people that are lactose intolerant, they can't take pasteurized milk, because it doesn't have that bacteria to help you digest it. Yeah,
Melissa Urban:I haven't dug in enough to say for sure whether the benefits of raw milk outweigh the potential downsides. And the potential downsides are pretty serious. Because it's not pasteurized, you are running a risk of getting sick with raw milk like you wouldn't with a pasteurized milk. So, you know, for me, dairy works pretty well, for me in some contexts, I can do some cheese here and there, I can do some sour cream here and there. I don't have any digestive issues from it or other issues. I don't miss milk. I don't particularly like drinking milk. So that's not been an area of research that I've done a lot of. But I would just say before you do dive into raw milk, just do some research for yourself and make sure you understand some of the risks that may be associated. And then absolutely make sure you know where that's coming from. I would if I were to drink raw milk, I would only come from a you know, local source where I was very familiar with their farming practices.
Chuck Shute:Yeah, I think the other thing that scares me too is they say this is the worst time to try it because of the bird flu. Yeah. That adds another layer that I'm like, yeah. Fun trying that for now, I just do like a fat free like a Greek probiotic yogurt and that for me that it has a protein and I feel like it helps my stomach and I used to have acid reflux, and I just don't even have that anymore.
Melissa Urban:Yeah, I think that's great. I've been taking a colostrum supplement for a couple months now. So it is a dairy based supplement. It's colostrum from cows. So it's bovine. But it's it has been, at least they say that it's good for things like allergies and your immune symptoms. I read a study in which it was positively correlated with improved asthma symptoms. So I've been taking it for a couple of months just to sort of test it out because colostrum has been like all over my tic toc for you page. And I don't know that I've necessarily noticed immediate benefits, but I will say my digestion is very smooth. So that's nice. I don't know if it's the colostrum or just my normal diet, but I'm going to keep taking it for a little bit. And there are a lot of people who really swear by it.
Chuck Shute:Yeah. Well, so one thing that's still the same on this whole 32 Is that the pancake rule explained. Pig rule is this is this is interesting. It
Melissa Urban:is so you know on the whole 30 Of course you're eliminating these foods that are commonly problematic and that includes you know, added sugar and alcohol, grains, legumes dairy in most forms, but there's another rule that also says that you can't recreate baked goods, like bread and pasta and brownies and cookies, you can't recreate pasta, or cereal or potato chips or french fries, even if they're wit made with compatible ingredients. So there are technically whole 30 quality fingers compatible potato chips, right, they're just Potatoes cooked in olive and avocado oil. Or you can have, you know, grain free breads, or pasta made from alternative flours like cassava flour I've seen brownie recipes, people get very, very creative with their grain free dairy free recipes. And of course, there are a lot more grain free flowers and dairy free milks available now. But we tell you that you have to eliminate that from the program. And that is because if you want to change your habits on the whole 30 and learn other ways to navigate stress and self soothe and relieve anxiety and boredom, you're not going to do that if you still have available to you all of the same comfort foods, because your brain doesn't know the difference between your normal potato chips. And these Jackson's sweet potato chips. It just knows that you weren't feeling great. And you went into the pantry and you hoovered a bag of potato chips. So we did a survey with our community is over 1100 whole 30 years, would you have been just as successful with the whole 30 If the pancake rule wasn't in place, meaning you could eat all the potato chips you wanted all the fast food french fries you wanted you could make the brownies you could make the pancakes. And 89% of people said absolutely not. Absolutely not what I have been successful with the whole 30 and my life changing transformation. If that rule hadn't been in place, it's what makes the whole 30 unique. And I think it's vitally important to our big picture mission of helping people change their emotional relationship with food. Yeah,
Chuck Shute:changing the habits. Yeah. One thing that's interesting, too, is that you you don't want people to weigh themselves can can they weigh themselves before and after that just not during the whole third? Correct?
Melissa Urban:Yes, you know, the whole 30 is not a weight loss program. We are it is not designed to help you lose weight. And so we don't offer guidance around losing weight, you're not counting calories, you're not restricting calories, you're not restricting meal timing, or portions or macros. You're eating to satiety. Anytime you're hungry, you should eat something, and you're stopping when you're full. And so I don't want people weighing themselves throughout the whole 30 Because it is the fastest way to short circuit, your progress. I have had so many people message me after their whole 30 is over on day 30. Chuck, they will send me a note and they will say I feel I feel amazing, I have so much more energy, my sleep is better. I don't have allergies anymore. Those symptoms have all gone. I haven't had a migraine in 30 days, but I only lost two pounds. What did I do wrong? And I'm like, did you hear yourself, you just told me that everything in your life got better. But because you didn't lose as much weight as you wanted to or you thought you need to do all of a sudden your whole 30 is a failure. So we really want to shift that mindset away from intentional weight loss for the purposes of this program. And have you focus on all of the non scale victories that can happen when you change the food on your plate?
Chuck Shute:Yeah, I wonder too, if people measured their body fat percentage and had blood work before and after if though, because I mean, isn't it the ultimate goal is like health for me. I mean, I think for a lot of people that's a big, maybe it's not maybe the weight is a piece of it too. But I think health is very important.
Melissa Urban:It is when we do surveys with our community as to what your kind of number one reason is for completing the whole 30 You're wanting to do the whole 30 Actually, the number one reason is cravings. People say I feel as though I am out of control with my cravings, I have these cravings and I eat more than I want to. And it leads to that negative cycle. And I feel like if I have this food in the house, I'm gonna end up eating all of it. And I tell myself, I'm not going to buy it, but I buy it anyway. I want to do the whole 30 to see if I can help diminish some of these cravings and learn other ways to satisfy whatever emotional response is coming up that doesn't automatically involve reaching for a food or drink.
Chuck Shute:Yeah, I mean, the whole 30 It is hard. I'm gonna I'm gonna be the first so I've done it a few times. It's very difficult. I wanted to get your thoughts on this though, because we live in such a, you know, fast food society. Everybody wants, I want it now give me the pill. And this ozempic And these similar kind of drugs. They scare me a little bit and I'm not a doctor, I'm not telling you to go off it or to start it or whatever. I can't give people advice on that. But it just concerns me. And I think I read a statistic today. I don't know if it's accurate. That said, One in eight people are using these. And I just feel like I don't we don't know the long term effects. I feel like there could be some side effects to this that they don't know about yet. I don't know what are your thoughts on this?
Melissa Urban:Yeah, I mean, so I'm not an expert in this area. And I will also say that I've never had to intentionally diet for weight loss genetically, that's just not been a thing for me. So, you know, I have heard a lot of people who have been obese yeast, or they have health conditions who have said for the first time in my life, when I'm on these medications, the food noise in my head quiets. I feel like I'm no longer so hyper, you know, aware of and preoccupied with food. And for them that feels amazing and incredible. And I would never, you know, want to take that away from them. I do think there are side effects that we are now aware of, though, people do tend to lose muscle mass, a lot of muscle mass and part of their weight loss journey. And we also don't really know what's going to happen when people tailor or kind of taper off of them. I think a study just came out talking about people who had been on these weight loss drugs and followed them for a few years after, and most of them were able to keep I think it was 10% of the weight that they had lost off, don't quote me on it. So we're starting to see some of these studies. But I know one of the biggest concerns that doctors have is while you are on these weight loss drugs, what are you doing in terms of changing your diet and lifestyle to support, you know, the drugs, work in your system, and to make sure that you're nourishing your body. And also, when you come off of the drugs? What does your diet and lifestyle look like so that you can also continue to maintain these weight loss efforts. And I think that's a really, it's a, it's a subject that a lot of food companies are starting to try to take advantage of and move into Nestle just announced a new line of foods that are specifically tailored to people on GLP ones and they're like, you know, super processed lasagna was and there was maybe I forget some kind of fritatta or something. But food manufacturers are definitely trying to take advantage of this. And I'm over here, like, you know, or you could just like eat whole 30 ish, because what we're doing is it's really on point in terms of, you know, micro nutrition and nutrient density. Yeah, it's interesting.
Chuck Shute:Yeah, I mean, I think it's just is really hard to do all 30. But, you know, one of the things you talk about in the book is, you know, finding your why, like, why you want to do this, and then just kind of using that as your motivation.
Melissa Urban:Yeah, we always talk about finding your why. Because we're not a weight loss program. We want people to really think about the way that the whole 30 is going to impact not only their life, but also their relationships, their parenting, their work, their self confidence, their, you know, gym and other hobbies and activities. So we we talk about, and we provide exercises to find your why What are you hoping the whole 30 is going to achieve? If you're going into the hole 30, hoping to reduce your cravings? Why why is that important? Well, it would be really important, so I didn't feel like I was preoccupied with food all the time. So when I was in social situations, I could actually enjoy the social connection more and not be so anxious around, what am I eating? What are other people eating? Am I eating too much so that I could sit down and watch a movie with my spouse and not worry that I'm going to be constantly thinking about like, what could I eat? And should I eat something? And is it too late to eat that food noise would quiet? And if you take it a step further? Well, what would that mean for you? Like I would feel more at peace, I would feel more grounded, I would have more self confidence, I would feel more connected to the people that I'm with. And when you go get that deep in terms of your WHY it then becomes very easy on the whole 30. Because it is hard when you're faced with that moment of temptation of somebody saying, Oh, would you like a glass of wine? And you're like, Oh, I'm on day 14? To say, No, thank you. Because this idea of being feeling peaceful and grounded, and no longer anxious around food is far more important to me than the momentary flash of pleasure I might get with that first sip of wine.
Chuck Shute:Yeah. And that kind of goes back to your other book, the book of boundaries and setting boundaries with food. And because that is one of the biggest things I feel like, especially for guys, like, you know, like, if you're hanging out other guys, and everybody's drinking beers and stuff, and you're like, oh, you know, you're not either controlling the whole 30. Or maybe you just want to cut out alcohol or whatever, you're trying to be healthier. It's hard to to be the one guy that's not eating junk food and drinking beer.
Melissa Urban:It definitely can be. And I think it tends to be especially when people are faced with peer pressure. So if all of your guy friends are giving you a really hard time for not drinking or saying you're no fun, or oh, just have one that can be really, really hard. But even in the absence of peer pressure, I think we feel uncomfortable, not doing the thing that everyone else is doing. And I like to look at the whole 30 as an opportunity to sort of flex those boundary muscles. You know, walk into a birthday party and say no thank you to the cake, because you can celebrate just as much and feel just as festive. No matter what happens to be on your plate. Go to the wedding and toast with your sparkling water instead of champagne. It's just as meaningful. Go out with your girlfriends, like I did one year at St. Patrick's Day and not drink beer. I was like no, I'm just gonna have water. I'm not drinking right now. And I had just as much fun and I left a little bit early before everyone else got really drunk and annoying. I got myself to bed early, and I woke up feeling great the next day. And I was like, This is awesome. Yeah, I think if you do have some of those positive experiences, it really boosts your self confidence. And then whether you choose to drink or choose not to drink, you feel like okay, like, either way, I know I'm gonna have a great time.
Chuck Shute:No, that's a great example. Because I think that too, like, it's sometimes it's fun, just go early. If you're not drinking and just hanging out with people until the end, you get really wasted. And then it makes me think, too, like, if I have to drink a lot to have fun, then what am I doing? Like, why am I so I like I'm if this isn't fun, sober than why am I doing it, so I have to have alcohol to enjoy this activity will, I mean, I can just have alcohol in my house and have the same effect. I mean, it kind of makes you think about what how you're spending your time, if that's you need this alcohol, if, if it's not fun to hang out with these people, unless you're drunk, then maybe you need new friends or nine
Melissa Urban:situations. I know, that's a good piece of tough love right there. One of the things I like the most about my girlfriends now is that, you know, 10 years ago, the invitations would be like, let's go out and have drinks, let's go out and have, you know, a glass of wine on the patio. And now I'm getting phone calls. And it's like, Hey, let's go to like the 8am yoga class and then go to brunch. That's what we want to do. Now. We want to do activities, we want to go for a hike, we want to go for yoga. So you know, it's great if you can have if you have friends that like to drink, but also like doing other things, maybe you just join them in those other things. Because nights out at the bar are not fun for you anymore. Or like you said, maybe you go but you say yeah, I can only stay for like two hours or until you guys get drunk at because that's not fun for me. And then you leave, you know, I think there are a lot of different ways to slice and dice it that don't have to involve getting new friends. But if the only thing is your friends like to do is go out and get really, really drunk. And that's just not serving you, then yeah, I think you'd be better off finding new friends.
Chuck Shute:Yeah, I was just like, because I'm in Scottsdale, and I'm like a mile and a half from all these clubs. And like those, sometimes they're kind of fun. Like during the day, they'll play sports or whatever. And they're kind of the music's kind of low, but after like nine or 10. It's just like this loud EDM. And I feel like nobody is really enjoying this, like, unless they're on drugs or alcohol. Like, I just feel like nobody really likes the music this much. I mean, maybe they do. Or maybe I'm the weirdo that's just like, this looks like hell to me. I
Melissa Urban:don't Yeah, I'll leave that to like the kids, I'll leave that to the Gen Z. I'm in bed by like nine or 930. These days. That's my idea of a good time. But
Chuck Shute:it's like, it's really because that's what the whole 30 is all about is like, it's really not only just changing your diet, it's just like change your whole lifestyle. And then leading a healthy lifestyle and then feeling better, I think exercise. I mean, it's not really mentioned in the book, but that can be a big part of it a good supplement to this whole thing.
Melissa Urban:Oh, absolutely. You know, the whole 30 is only about food. And that that is all we talk about. That's what we you know, you eliminate and reintroduce, there's no exercise component. There's no sleep component. There's no meditation or journaling or anything. But what I find is that people start to feel so good. By the second week, their energy is rockin they're sleeping great, their cravings are down, they feel so self confident, you know, maybe their Bloating is gone. And their aches and pains are less than very naturally leads them to say what else can I do? I hear people all the time you say I'm walking more, I'm going to the gym more often, or I hit a PR in the gym. You know, I'm doing better in my intramural soccer games. And that just leads to you know, all of these things are sort of a self fulfilling prophecy where it spills over into every other area of your life, you're more confident at work and more outgoing and maybe more social, and you're spending more time with your family. Maybe you're meal prepping and cooking together. And it improves your relationships. And, you know, I hear all the time the whole 30 is about food, but it's about so much more than food and the benefits can spill over into every area of your life. Definitely,
Chuck Shute:yeah, you're gonna have more energy and it's more time like it. Like we said, if you're not going out to the clubs and spending three or four or five hours, what do you do with that five hours now you can be more productive energy for go for a walk, exercise or just go to bed and then wake up early and start the day earlier?
Melissa Urban:Yeah, yeah, absolutely. I mean, people really do. They share all kinds of stories with me, thanks to my whole 30 I finally dumped my toxic boyfriend. Thanks to my whole 30 I finally quit my job and got a new one. Thanks to my whole 30 I went back to school. And now I'm going to be a registered dietitian and a few years I hear stories like that all the time. And the impetus is the self confidence and self sense of self efficacy that the whole 30 brings, which I think is really cool. Wow,
Chuck Shute:that really is amazing. Like, that's like I look up to you so much that you're able to do this, especially given your background like you. You turned everything around, and then you created this amazing thing and you're helping so many people. It's like it's awesome.
Melissa Urban:It's pretty cool. Yeah, I really love what I do. I'm very impact driven. So for me, the best part of my job is just getting to hear people's whole 30 stories, their success stories. That's the thing that makes me the happiest.
Chuck Shute:Like how many of those messages do you get a day?
Melissa Urban:I mean, a lot. I get probably hundreds of DMS a day but I feel like you know I was just in Costco over the last two weekends doing some events for their chicken or for our whole 30 Chicken and I had a woman came up and she was like I did the whole 30 and I haven't had a migraine and you know seven years since I did my first full 30 and I used to get them every single day. And I had a 12 year old girl come up to me at her at my last event, who was doing the whole 30 with her mom. And I asked her why she was doing the whole 30 with her mom. And she said, Because I have a lot of anxiety. And I've noticed in the last two weeks on the whole 30 that I feel more calm. And I'm like trying really hard not to cry, right? There's this sweet little girl who's telling me giving me kind of the impact of the whole 30 on her life. Yeah, it's really powerful. It's super powerful for me, and it makes me really excited to see what else I could do to help people be more successful with the program.
Chuck Shute:That's amazing. What are your thoughts on some of these other practices that are have some similarities to hold? 30 But like, because for some people, it sounds like vegetables are upsetting for them or cause issues like, like the carnivore diet, and there's this other one called the lion diet, that is even more extreme. But yeah, some people they really work. Is that placebo? Or do you think that there really is some science behind that?
Melissa Urban:So you know, a carnivore diet is was designed to be a short term medical intervention for people with really serious gastric issues. And it's almost a last ditch effort where it's like, look, we don't really know what's going on, you have some kind of, you know, gastric issue, it's maybe it's IBS, or IBD, or Crohn's, we're going to pull it, we're gonna pull fiber out, we're gonna pull out, you know, anything that could potentially be inflammatory, and which I think is interesting, because red meat can also be inflammatory for some people. But it was designed as this short term kind of medical intervention, and then people have latched on to it. And now it's like, I just eat carnivore forever, and I don't eat any vegetables at all. And for me, you know, I do think it works really well for some people. And again, I said, there's no one size fits all. And maybe that's an approach that works well for you. But I also have to wonder, could you achieve various, the same or very similar benefits, just by being more conscientious about the form of carbohydrates that you put in your body, or by doing an elimination program that isn't so extreme that helps you figure out the foods that work best for you, but still allows you to eat the stuff that does work? Well, maybe a carnivore approach, but you still eat these 10 different vegetables, and white rice and oats and quinoa, could give you a more balanced diet with a more variety of micronutrients, and achieve maybe the same goals. I do worry about really those those very extreme protocols doing them long term. And what you're missing out on in terms of micro nutrition and nutritional balance, even the whole 30 is not meant to be done forever, as as nutritionally balanced as the whole 30 is during the elimination phase, you still shouldn't do that forever. So I also worry about people who who restrict that dramatically, you know, we've shown in the literature shown that that can lead to some pretty serious rebound effects and disordered eating habits. So all of that to say, you know, take these approaches on conscientiously and with caution. Even the whole 30 is contra indicated if you have a history of disordered eating, because the restriction and any elimination diet can be triggering. So you have to know your context. And, you know, I would say my, my philosophy is minimum effort, maximum effect, how little can you eliminate and still get the majority of the benefits? And that's where I think the whole 30 has a nice sweet spot.
Chuck Shute:Yeah, I mean, you're cutting out some things that pretty, you know, pretty much most people can agree are probably okay to cut out like alcohol and processed foods and sugar. Yeah, that's a big one.
Melissa Urban:Yeah, it comes. Yeah.
Chuck Shute:What are your thoughts on cooking because you mentioned like, you know, you can use the microwave to cook these whole 30 foods. It seems like they demonize now everything because, like, you know, the air fryers come out. I don't know. I mean, I think those are okay, but, you know, people say microwaves are bad. And then you know, they said grilling is bad because the charred food is bad. And then they said recently, gas stoves are bad. I'm like, I'm running out of things to cook my now.
Melissa Urban:Pretty soon it's like you can't have anything by air and even the air isn't good enough. You know? I think there's probably nuggets of truth and all of these microwaving for example, I don't love the idea of microwaving plastics, especially for a long time right. So transfer your whole 30 chicken to a glass storage bowl and microwave it in that but the microwave itself I have no problem with grilling, I have no problem with should you take a processed hot dog and grill the crap out of it so it gets super blackened and charred and that's your only source of protein. Probably not on an everyday basis but I don't really sweat it if my Applegate protein gets a little char on the grill once in a while, you know so I think people I don't want to miss the forest for the trees. I want you cooking food at home and if you read all of this stuff and you think to yourself, Well none of these cooking methods are safe, so I'm just gonna buy I don't know, you know, I'm just gonna get takeout every night. I think you're kind of missing the point. I really don't like people who fear monger around food I I think there's certainly some truth to some of the concepts of, you know, plastics in food or BPA and food, I understand all of that I really, really do. And also, there are a lot of people for whom it's just a struggle to eat real food, or to source real food or just source protein. So you have to meet people where they are, and I really want the whole 30 to be as accessible as possible. Which means we do our best not to fear monger and to say to people like Let good enough be good enough in this case. Yeah,
Chuck Shute:once and then we have to, you know, we can't cook all our food on a campfire like we're cavemen. We have to live in the society that we're in. And so I just tried to do a variety I tried to okay, I'm using microwave today is the grill use the oven use the airfryer. So that way, if one of them's bad, at least I'm not doing it every day. Yeah.
Melissa Urban:I think, you know, I think we're doing we all have to do the best we can with what we have. You're absolutely right. Yeah.
Chuck Shute:And what about now you're gonna get mad at me for fearmongering more, but salmon. So you salmon was I think it's in the first book, and it's in this one. And you talk about wild caught versus farmed. Explain, because that is something I am scared of, though, because they say like, I know, Tony Robbins talked about he would eat tuna fish every day. And then he had just like off the charts, level of mercury. So it's wild caught salmon is better, but you just is it moderation? Maybe like once a week or something? Or what are the rules on this. So salmon
Melissa Urban:doesn't have the same mercury content is tuna. So you don't seems caveats there, it really is just to know that you would need to be careful of because the mercury levels and that's one of the things that like is legit, if you eat too much tuna, especially if your kind of processing for these heavy metals is compromised genetically, then yes, you can have problems. When we talk about wild caught salmon or grass fed ground beef, or free range organic chicken, we're really talking about the environment in which the animal is raised and fed, it tends to impact the micronutrient content of that animal. So grass fed ground beef does tend to have a bit more omega three fatty acids, wild caught salmon does tend to have more micronutrients versus the farmed version. And the from an animal welfare perspective, it's much better for the animals in a more natural environment. So regenerative farming practices, or free range chicken as opposed to factory farmed chicken, which are kept in cages and crates. There are a lot of things to consider when we talk about things like well, you know, grass fed and wild caught. However, again, I just want you to eat your protein, and make sure you're getting enough protein to be health promoting and wild caught salmon is very expensive, especially out of season. So if you can get frozen salmon if you can get Atlantic salmon, if you get farm raised salmon, I still think you're getting a lot of good healthy omega three fatty acids. And if that is what is accessible to you, then that's what I want you to purchase any and I promise you that will be good enough. Yeah,
Chuck Shute:I used to live in Washington, we had this Copper River salmon. It was only available for like a month. It was the best thing. I don't know if Oh, yeah, I've anymore though. It's like I think they're like, they don't have it. I know it's only in season for like a week or something. I used to be like a month or two months and say
Melissa Urban:no. Well, it's because wild caught salmon is being overfished now, too, right? That's what the issue is. Yeah. So
Chuck Shute:there are some benefits to the farm salmon too, because it's more sustainable. So it's kind of like, yeah, it's confusing a little bit.
Melissa Urban:It definitely can be I find, so Monterey Bay Aquarium has a really good kind of Seafood Watch program that can help you figure out from a sustainability perspective, if you're buying shrimp if you're buying salmon if you're buying white fish. But again, if you have the capacity to buy wild caught, that's your best case scenario, or that's a really great choice. But I don't want you just not eating fish or salmon at all, if you can't afford or don't have access to that best case. Yeah,
Chuck Shute:I mean, I'm asking like some of the more advanced Yes, is there like I mean, for people who are just starting have never done a whole 30 Or just are going you know, going from pizza and Doritos, and I'm like, I want to be healthier, just eating real foods. Don't worry about all the other stuff. I'm talking about more because I'm trying to like, even go to the next level.
Melissa Urban:Yeah, that makes sense. You know, once you once you once the basics of eating whole food, people comfortable, right? You're comfortable grocery shopping and meal planning and cooking a variety of vegetables and protein at home. And once that feels more comfortable, it's only natural to Then branch out into asking yourself more questions. Well, what vegetables are in season right now? Or what can I get locally? What's at my farmers market? What's the difference between or you know, grass fed and conventionally raised? That's a very natural progression. But you're absolutely right. I never want to overwhelm someone coming in for the very first time with all of that nuance. It's like your only job is to eat whole 30 Food for 30 days. That's as simple as it needs to be I promise.
Chuck Shute:No, and that's what's the new book is great. There's some like amazing recipes, some new the bunch of new recipes and stuff I want to I don't want to spoil it but like, you know Like, can I say the yes thing about smoothies? Like there's, there's this smoothies or okay now, which is exciting. Yeah. So like there's a coffee barbecue sauce and some of this. I haven't tried it yet, but like, there's a frittata that I mean, it looks like a pizza. It looks amazing, but it's like healthy. So there's a lot of exciting recipes that I think like you said earlier about the tastebuds like people like oh, I can actually like taste the strawberry. Like, I think you really can enjoy these foods if you give it a chance.
Melissa Urban:Yeah, we recreate we created all new recipes for this book. So there's over 100 recipes. We did keep one or two favorites from the original book in so there's a Melissa's chicken hash. Yes. I love them. Yeah, it's an awesome egg free breakfast because people get really tired of eggs for breakfast. But we've we've tweaked the recipe a little bit. And there's a cooling yogurt rainbow sauce that comes with it now that I just want to put on absolutely everything. It is so good. So we're introducing you to new flavors, but all of the ingredients in this cookbook you can find at your local grocery store, or you can just order online. And we want to introduce people to culturally significant ingredients. We have a lot of culturally inspired dishes. But again, we always give you substitutions if you can't find a specific ingredient. But you may find a new flavor profile that you absolutely love and didn't even realize that you could buy that spice at your local grocery store.
Chuck Shute:Yeah, it's amazing. I've learned a lot from you. I follow you. I follow a lot of like food influencers I don't know or health influencers. What are your thoughts on that? Is there anybody else that you follow? Are you in a community with these other people like food Babe and stuff? Do you follow them? Are you friends with them or
Melissa Urban:not? Not food, babe. No, but I do. Do you want me to talk about this I find her credibility lacking and I find her at the height of fear mongering I'm not a fan. However, I really do. Like Danielle Walker is a dear friend of mine. She has an auto immune digestive disorder and creates a lot of recipes that are very family friendly. She does a lot of baking as well that are really perfect for anybody who has even the most sensitive stomachs or digestive disorders. Michelle tam is a good friend of mine she is nom nom paleo. And she has a ton of delicious will 30 compatible recipes. She pulls a lot from her, you know from Asian heritage from her Asian heritage. So that's a really, that's someone I really love to follow. There's someone called cat can cook, she's on the internet, or on the internet. She's on Instagram. And she just had a new book cookbook come out called big bites. I love her approach. She's one of those big hearty salad persons. So her food is absolutely delicious. There are a few plant based recipe creators that I follow who I love a lot because we have a plant based whole 30 now and I'm always looking for good plant based inspiration. So I tend to follow people who make really, really delicious food and I kind of don't care about the background of that food. It doesn't have to be paleo or vegan or low carb or any of that if it's you know, good food is good food. And so yeah, my Instagram is full of like delicious food, Taylor Swift fitness and hiking.
Chuck Shute:Is there any way that you could? Because I'm just so worried about this country? I mean, maybe the world too, but especially America, and just like, you know, chronic disease and just people just not being healthy? Is there any way that you can use your power and influence with the government? And maybe at the very least, I mean, maybe not necessarily banning foods, but getting more visibility? Because I feel I feel like people are lost, and they buy foods that are marketed as healthy and diet when they're probably making them sicker. I
Melissa Urban:know, we may I made the decision many years ago, you know, whole 30 has been around for 15 years now. And I made the decision that rather than try to get involved with politics, or government or the school system or anything at a very high level, I was going to go all the way down and just change lives one person at a time. That was what I was good at. That was what I could do. That was what I had experience with. So that's how I'm choosing to approach whole 30s influence, which is if enough people change their lives one at a time. And their voices become loud enough, I have seen firsthand companies change their ingredient profiles and change their, you know, one of our whole 30 approved partners organic Ville went through and reformulated more than 40 products to remove the added sugar so they could be whole 30 compatible and whole 30 approved. That's excuse me, that's real change. And that change is happening. One person at a time. That's where I feel like well 30s impact can lie and where our sweet spot could be. That's
Chuck Shute:amazing. Yeah, I mean, you helped me and my girlfriend like we we started doing we've done it a few times and it's changed the way that we look at food and cook now. So it's helped me a lot as well. So hopefully the other people can be inspired by this and get the book when does the book come out? What is it date for August 6, August 6. So the new Yeah, I highly recommend it. I've read both of them. This one's exciting. And this is cool that you're, you know, now if people were vegan can can jump on board and try this too.
Melissa Urban:I now you know, that was a huge project for us, we launched the plant based whole 30 and 2020 because so many people had said, I want to do the whole 30. But I don't eat meat and we didn't really have a good way for them to participate in the community. So we worked with a our team of registered dieticians to create a balanced program that you know, manage help people manage blood sugar really well, during the elimination phase. I'm really excited to roll it out with the new book with more than 50 new recipes for the program. It's the first time it appears in print. And I think, you know, again, it just serves to make the whole 30 even more accessible to a broad range of people.
Chuck Shute:Yeah, I'm excited for those whole 30 Costco meals that would be nice to have every now and then I'm in a rush and I got it. Yeah. It'd be nice to have that. I
Melissa Urban:know. I want them to get what if they get into Arizona, they'll also get into Utah where I live. So that's obviously on my priority list, right? Because I can't even buy them at my local Costco yet. Okay, now we're working on it. Like I said, they're brand spankin new.
Chuck Shute:Great. Well, thank you so much, Melissa. And yeah, I'll get this episode up soon. Thank
Melissa Urban:you, Chuck. It's always good to talk to you. Yeah. Good to talk to you too. All right. That was fine.
