Michael Crain (Dead Cross, Retox)

Michael Crain is a guitarist, singer, producer and songwriter best known as the guitarist of the bands Kill the Capulets, Retox & Dead Cross. He joined Dead Cross with Justin Pearson, Mike Patton & Dave Lombardo. The band has new album out now, simply titled “Dead Cross 2.”  We discuss the new music, Michael’s cancer battle, Mike Patton’s burnout & more!

00:00 - Intro
00:47 - Dead Cross Genre
02:15 - Mike Patton & Songwriting
04:25 - Dave Lombardo & Band Formation
09:47 - Mike Patton Burnt Out
13:02 - Other Projects for Michael
13:58 - Songs on New Album
14:40 - Ross Robinson & Producers
17:17 - Beating Cancer & Inspiration
25:05 - Touring, Making Records & Band Life
28:05 - Dogs & Charity
29:01 - Outro

Dead Cross website:
https://deadcross.bandcamp.com/

Humane Society website:
https://www.humanesociety.org/

Chuck Shute website:
http://chuckshute.com/

Transcript

Chuck Shute: 0:00

All right, coming up today we have Michael crane of the band Dead cross dead crosses, basically a super group that also includes Justin Pearson, Mike Patton, and Dave Lombardo, Justin and Michael were both in the band retox. And all four of these guys have been in tons of different bands. They're all very talented musicians. And Michael is here today to tell us all about that cross plus his health issues, the future for Mike Patton, and more. Just a note on this episode, there are some distractions in the interview. But unfortunately, that's just the price of doing interviews on Zoom. So please be patient with that. Michael crane coming right up all right, it's fine. I saw this meme the other day, yesterday, and it was like podcasters be like 40 minutes into the episode. Okay, well, let's just dive right in. So I'm starting at the beginning. Let's just dive right in Dead cross. The new album, dead cross two is not the most clever title I gotta say. But the music is. It's out there. I mean, it's all over the place. Right?

Michael Crain: 1:10

Yeah, it's a little all over the place. I agree.

Chuck Shute: 1:14

Does that how you I mean, it's such an interest. I don't even know how to describe this to people. It's a I think Wikipedia says a frantic paced mix of hardcore and punk.

Michael Crain: 1:24

That's what it says we could be doing so yeah. You know, I mean, yeah, I could see that. i Yeah, makes sense. With I don't know about the hardcore part. Though. There's nothing really hardcore. In our music. People use that term. Really? liberally. You know what I mean? Hardcore to me. Is that more like Agnostic Front, or something like that? You know what I mean? Like, the more bro stuff the tough guy hardcore that always to me seem to be hardcore. Everything else is like, punk post punk. Thrash Metal, like there's so many genres. Oh, no.

Chuck Shute: 2:07

I'm hearing like to me. I don't know. I don't know how I would describe it. But I hear like, definitely some speed metal stuff. Definitely some punk. And then also just kind of like some psychedelic like Mike Patton kind of stuff like Mr. Bungle kind of weird, just like weird noises and shit and screaming and

Michael Crain: 2:23

yeah, definitely. He's got his whole own. He's got his completely own sound. You know, he's got his own thing all together. That guy. He's, he's a genre in and of themselves. Right.

Chuck Shute: 2:38

Right. Yeah. How does that work with the songwriting? Because you, do you? I'm assuming you did a lot of the riffs yourself, and then you just pass it off to Patton. And he does his thing writes some lyrics. And

Michael Crain: 2:48

basically, yes, that's so with this band. And he's explained it to me. He's the he does it. He's done it differently in every band, right. So typically, he's very involved in all the writing, you know, he's, like, with faith, no more at Fanta moss. I know. He wrote everything literally. With Deb cross, he likes it because I'll come up with all the riffs me, Justin and Dave will jam from you know, get a loose structure together. And then we'll pass them off the demo. And with the first record, he had no input because it was are all already it was done. You know, that was when we had Gabe Serbian was our was our singer. So with the first record, he just got like finished songs, literally. And then with this record, he had a little more input because we you know, we had been a band now so he would tell me he's like, he kind of likes that, that he he's really into that process with this band. Because this new form, it's a change of pace where he doesn't have

Chuck Shute: 4:17

How did you get him involved in the in the first place? Did you guys already have relationship or did you just reach out to him to just to know him or?

Michael Crain: 4:25

No, Dave. Dave reached out to him. Okay, he's the one who had a relationship with them.

Chuck Shute: 4:31

Dave Lombardo the amazing what probably one of my favorite drummers hunting uh, how did you know him then?

Michael Crain: 4:38

So how I started was Justin and I were doing retox at the time. And one day, Justin, call me Oh, and Justin had done. headwind city he was doing head We're in city. And Hadwin city worked with Ross, because Cody and Jordan and blood brothers had worked with Ross in the past. So they had a relationship with Ross. That's how we met Ross, essentially. Okay. And one day Justin called me out. I was I was at work and he's like, Dude, are you text me? He's like, dude, do you want to? He's like, What are you doing tomorrow? He's like, do you want to do a studio project with Ross Robinson gave him borrow? No. And I was like, fuck yeah, I do. And so we went in. Dave had booked time for his band film that had broke just broken up get book time with Ross so so I guess Dave felt bad because the project broke up. He didn't want Ross to be out studio time and money you know, that he set aside for Dave. So Ross was like, you know, I don't worry about it, dude. You know, just I'll tell you what, just just play on my friends. My friends, daughters demos. I know it's really weird story. But so then. That's so that's that's how it came about. Justin happened to be available. I happen to be available. Because Ross was like, alright, Justin, you play bass. We need a guitarist. And I think obviously, their first choice was Cody, because they just worked with Cody Ross. I already knew Cody. Cody wasn't available. He wasn't around. And so Ross was like, Oh, what about that retox guitarist, he's sick. And that's when they call me and then so we we, we got together we did. Her name was Poppy Jean Crawford. We did three or four songs where she did like a demo, you know? It's really good. Really gothy in and then while we were in the studio jamming with Dave we clicked really well. I clicked really well. Dave I locked in with him right away. But I also grew up playing with drummers. My dad's a drummer, so I can I can jam. I know how to jam.

Chuck Shute: 7:36

A huge Slayer fan though. So we're a little bit starstruck to like, meet Dave Lombardo. Yeah,

Michael Crain: 7:41

for sure. For sure. I was like, Holy shit. Holy shit. And I had a slayer tattoo. And he thought He's like, he's all nice tattoo, bro. And I was like, and I started laughing. He's like, actually drew that logo was like, no shit. That's so cool.

Chuck Shute: 7:55

Wow. That's weird. That's like full circle.

Michael Crain: 7:59

And it is. It is literally is and I had that same I had that same thought I was like, God, if my 16 year old self could see this. You know what I mean? Like, that would fucking mind blown. You know?

Chuck Shute: 8:22

Have you had a lot of those moments? Throughout your musical career?

Michael Crain: 8:27

I have. I have had. Yes. I have had a few. Absolutely. Yeah. Where I was like, really? This is incredible. You know?

Chuck Shute: 8:35

Yeah. Not only that, you get to meet them. But you get to actually play with him. I mean, because I get to do the podcast. So I get to meet some really interesting people, but I don't I don't get to create something with them. That would be a totally different level.

Michael Crain: 8:47

Yeah, yep. Yep, absolutely, man. There's been several times where I'm like, it's like fuck, I'm on a tour bus with Patton and Lombardo and we're going to headline a stage at Hell fest. Which that was like the highlight of my of my career thus far. Honestly. That show in particular that tour. I was like, this is this is the fucking dream. This is incredible. That's really, yeah. Yeah. And I think it was probably like, it was in one of the big tents, so I don't know the capacity but it was like over overflowing with people for sure. So anyways, for me that was that was a big deal. Patton Lombardo that was fucking they've been doing that their whole lives, you know,

Chuck Shute: 9:39

another day at the office for them now,

Michael Crain: 9:41

literally. You know. I remember also this is this is an interesting story. That was the European summer festival circuit we were on right so we're hitting all the metal fans. stubbles and on I forget which one it was, we played a lot of them. But that's when Patton had started to express that. He didn't want to tour. You know, he really was. He'd been doing it so long he needed a break a mental break. And I remember thinking to myself, why why would you ever not want to do this this fucking rules? Then I saw I think it was on social media, I remember Instagram or some old pictures of like faith, no more something. And there was a picture of him. In that exact field, we were parked in all the buses, you know, like 30 years ago. Like really young, you know, I was like, what? I was like, Okay, I get it. He's been doing this dude has been in buses and in fields. And, and, you know, green rooms and fucking went out. When I was fucking a child. This guy was already doing this shit. It just gave me perspective. You know what I mean?

Chuck Shute: 11:23

So how's he doing? Because I think I heard you say something about he was struggling with the physical and mental health or is he just burned out? Or it's just more

Michael Crain: 11:31

mental stages. I think COVID really got to COVID exacerbated any other underlying pre existing stuff he had going, you know, like it like it did for a lot of people. So he's just interesting.

Chuck Shute: 11:45

So it didn't because it sounds like if you wanted a break, I mean, that would have been the chance to have that break.

Michael Crain: 11:52

Yeah, the isolation and stuff.

Chuck Shute: 11:59

So he just didn't have as much access to people. No, no. Cuz he seems like I'm more of a loner. Like maybe like, is a couple close friends or a girlfriend or?

Michael Crain: 12:12

Yeah. Was my dogs. Let's go play outside. He is. I mean, that was different. Oh. Yeah. I mean, I don't know what we're talking about something. I don't know. You know, that's I wouldn't be able to get into details, obviously, because I don't know.

Chuck Shute: 12:45

Yeah. So what's the status then? Obviously, you guys are not having any tour dates or anything? Because he's just not filling up the tour at this point.

Michael Crain: 12:53

Correct. That's it.

Chuck Shute: 12:57

So you're just doing promotion for the album, then would you do touring that? With your? Are you going to do touring with any of your other bands?

Michael Crain: 13:05

Yeah, I'm playing lead guitar in Fiddler right now. So that's keeping me busy. And I have other passion projects. You know, I have always got a band or two. Then I got cowards. We recorded that album. We didn't put it out yet. What else? We got another new project. We don't have a name for it yet. That's enough right there. I'm trying to not do so many bands, honestly.

Chuck Shute: 13:38

Is music is are you able to do it as a full time thing? Or do you have to do other stuff on the side to help pay the bills? After you

Michael Crain: 13:45

do other stuff on the side? It depends how much I'm touring. When God Christ is active, I don't need to do anything else.

Chuck Shute: 13:54

Okay, that's cool. Well, let's Yeah, so let's talk about the Armistead cross two. So some of the songs are actually completed in 2018. Right. And then others were riffs that you had just collected.

Michael Crain: 14:04

So yeah, some of the songs were completed in 2018. But we rearranged them completely with Ross. He's he was very involved in the arrangements in the writing. And yeah, the material we were short, we went through my phone and just grabbed riffs and parts and you know, Frankenstein together other songs and did some writing in the studio. We do that a lot with Ross.

Chuck Shute: 14:37

Yeah, so this Ross I just for some reason, I guess I'm kind of like new to this. I didn't know Ross Robinson, I'm looking him up. I'm like, Oh, this guy discovered corn Slynt this Olympic Olympic kid and Slipknot. I'm like, I've never heard of this guy before. Like, and he must be a really good producer and arranger.

Michael Crain: 14:53

He's a really good fucking producer and arranger. Oh, yeah. I think if you were around In the 90s and then the metal more you definitely know he was, you know, but he's also he's done the cure. He's done. He did at the drive in separator they guys don't a lot of really good really was that one band glass jaw? Yeah, they're fucking incredible he did those records. He's a badass,

Chuck Shute: 15:34

does he but because it said like he discovered Korn and Limp biskit and Slipknot? Did he does he find them? Like do people send him demos? And he picks him and wants to work with? Yeah,

Michael Crain: 15:45

I think so. Or he hears about Manny and he goes and checks them out live. And he's like, do Let's fucking do a record. Let me do your first record or whatever. I think that's the typical as far as I know,

Chuck Shute: 15:58

right? Yeah. So he must have like a really strong passion for music then.

Michael Crain: 16:03

Oh, yeah. 1,000% He's, he's the real deal.

Chuck Shute: 16:09

But it sounds like a very different producer than say like a Rick Rubin who's very like hands off. And it's all about the vibe. This guy is more like helping with actually arrange the music and right.

Michael Crain: 16:19

Yeah, well, I think Rick Rubin does had to, I think they have a similar process. They're, they're, they're all about performance. I've never worked with Rick Rubin. So I couldn't speak to that. But the documentaries I've seen or footage I've seen, He's the same. He's involved. Like, hey, you know, put the heads switch from the crash to the hats there. Or, let's lose that part and do that part twice. Instead, like Rick does all that stuff, too.

Chuck Shute: 16:49

Okay, maybe Maybe I was wrong. Then. I thought I saw that documentary. It seemed like he was more hands off than than usual. But I'm sure yeah, he has to do some of those things.

Michael Crain: 16:59

I yeah, I don't know. I've heard different things to you know, maybe vintage recruitment was more hands on maybe it depends on the band. Maybe it did true. I have no idea.

Chuck Shute: 17:09

Yeah, cuz he was a musician. I think at one point, I

Michael Crain: 17:12

think so. Yeah, it was always Ross Ross.

Chuck Shute: 17:16

Yeah, so talk about some of the non musical things that influenced because a lot of this record was influenced by things that you went through like your cancer then mental health, the pandemic, all that stuff, right?

Michael Crain: 17:27

Yeah. Pandemic No, but I didn't give a shit about that. As far as artistically I had just come out in cancer. So I was I was loving life during the pandemic, no traffic. I was fucking driving everywhere taking my dogs hiking every day. But yeah, coming out of cancer. Well, you know. So this is the timeline 2018 We started writing you know everyone, everyone got busy. I had my other project. So we started doing that. I produce that. And then I think around that time Mike and Dave's did that bungle record. Oh, let's see 2018 That was going on in 2009. Okay. 2009 teen got diagnosed in July

Chuck Shute: 18:55

of 2019

Michael Crain: 18:56

Yeah, treatments were started in October and they ended Thanksgiving the treatments were really brutal. I thought I was gonna die from those

Chuck Shute: 19:12

Yeah, was it three rounds of chemo but 31 rounds of radiation. So what is the difference with I don't understand

Michael Crain: 19:18

two different two completely different treatments. Radiation is actually shoot you with a laser with radiation, okay. To destroy a tumor or cancerous cells, and, and chemo just fucking wipes you out that that's everywhere. You know, that's an IV takes about six to seven hours each year.

Chuck Shute: 19:50

Listen, can you listen to music or movies? Yeah,

Michael Crain: 19:53

you can do whatever have people visit you Let's see. So yeah, so anyways I mean, I just threw up for weeks and weeks nonstop all day every day. I couldn't I couldn't get any I couldn't. There's nothing I can do. I just lost all my everything okay, trying to remember and I'm trying to keep these dogs quiet at the same time. Yeah. So then after that, so yeah, during treatments when I thought I might die. I also when I realized, okay, I realized I was going to recover and I was going to be okay. And it was just like, well, I don't know if I will do it. But I was like, You know what, fuck this. I'm not dying from your shit. I want to play music with my friends. I want to finish that record. I want to see it through. So that's when like, when I got towards the end of treatments, that's when I reached out to me. And I was like, let's do this. And they were like, Dude, are you sure? Like how? You're, you know? Really? Are you okay? And I'm like, I don't care. Let's finish the record. So that's what we did. When we started in December, right on the heels of my treatments, I was still sick. I was still in pain. But yeah.

Chuck Shute: 21:40

So music I mean, it helps save you though. This this album, like really? Like kind of saved your life. It gave you something to look forward to push actly.

Michael Crain: 21:47

Yeah, yep. Exactly. Yeah. So that yeah, that's what happened. And then we got together and it was, that's what we need. That's what really helped me recover that that's what sped up my recovery. Got off the pain meds got off everything. You know, I just stood there and fucking pain that studio every day and tracked and row arranged and rearranged. And take after take after take. Yeah,

Chuck Shute: 22:20

yeah. How does that work? So you just push through the physical pain because I know, you have a history with substances. So you have to be careful. You don't want to get take too many pain pills, because then you can get addicted and stuff. So like, you just have to kind of tough it out.

Michael Crain: 22:34

No, no, no, I've had to take a lot of pain medication. For surgeries. You don't have a choice. Yeah. I mean, I'm active in a 12 step program. I fortunately, haven't had that problem yet. Where I was like, oh, hooked again. You know, just take them as directed. And when it's time to get off on the Get off them.

Chuck Shute: 22:59

Because you had to get off on when you're recording. Right. You had to you were off at that point. So you just have

Michael Crain: 23:04

no no, I was getting I was getting awesome while recording.

Chuck Shute: 23:10

Okay. Yeah. The phasing it out. So that helped you phase it out, though.

Michael Crain: 23:15

Yeah, it was still isn't completely unpleasant. Horrible. But yeah. Yeah.

Chuck Shute: 23:20

That's crazy. So how does that work? Like if you're a musician? Like do you have health insurance or the like, do

Michael Crain: 23:28

I have to pay for it myself? It's privately. Okay,

Chuck Shute: 23:32

that's friggin expensive. Yeah. And then they do they still give you a bunch of bills? Or do it was a cover? 100%?

Michael Crain: 23:40

No, I got it all. I still had my premium. I still had a monthly bill. But I got a lot of charity care. And yeah, they were good. It was if I didn't get all the help. It is insanely expensive and brutal. There's no way there's absolutely no way chemo and radiation are really fucking expensive.

Chuck Shute: 24:11

Yeah, so then you get through that. So it's changed. Has it changed your perspective on life? At all? I mean, it must have changed some things.

Michael Crain: 24:20

Yeah, but it's hard to keep the perspective change. You don't I mean, coming out of that, yeah, you're like a whole new lease on life. Never wait, never waste. Yeah. But then, you know, life catches up and builds and things and eventually you start to the perspective starts to kind of drift a little bit.

Chuck Shute: 24:45

Gotcha. Yeah. So if you think back to that still, you

Michael Crain: 24:49

know, like that you can be grateful. Yeah, you'd be like, try to stay as grateful as possible and not waste anytime you have cuz you don't know when your time is gonna be really?

Chuck Shute: 25:04

Absolutely. No, that's cool. I hope you guys are able to do some shows like I think that would be cool. Especially if that's like that can be a thing where that can be your main moneymaker. Job is. That sounds like a fun job to tour with Doug Krause.

Michael Crain: 25:20

best job ever. Yeah.

Chuck Shute: 25:24

Is that the most fun you've had in a band?

Michael Crain: 25:26

Um, I don't know. I've that's a lot of fun. Yes, but dude, I've been in management whole life. So you know what I mean? is they're all different. All different experiences. Yeah. You can't say comparing apples and oranges sometimes, you know?

Chuck Shute: 25:45

Yeah, absolutely. Well, you got some other projects that you're working on right now too. So,

Michael Crain: 25:51

yeah. Be busy.

Chuck Shute: 25:53

Do you like touring more or recording? And creating,

Michael Crain: 25:58

they both satisfy different ages? You know what I mean? It's, I like them both. A lot.

Chuck Shute: 26:06

That's good, though. Because like, there's so many bands right now that just they just tour and they don't make any music. I don't understand that. That seems like you're missing a huge piece of being a musician in my opinion.

Michael Crain: 26:16

Yeah, I mean, dude, people do it all different ways. You know, for me, I like the whole I like the whole experience. It's a lifestyle. The whole package you know, I mean,

Chuck Shute: 26:29

yeah, even though there's chaos, right? I mean, it's gotta be chaotic. Being a musician. You never know. Like, are you getting a gig? Are you not gonna have any gig there's dry spells and then there's hot stream salutely

Michael Crain: 26:39

Yeah, you gotta get used to all that. It all comes with the territory

Chuck Shute: 26:46

Yeah, and then eventually I mean, I think that's common like what Mike Patton is going through where you just get kind of burned out at some point

Michael Crain: 26:56

I'm surprised that doesn't happen Yeah. But finisher his firewood will reignite, you know? Yeah, that guy.

Chuck Shute: 27:02

Well, yeah, cuz it doesn't hurt his throat though to to scream like that. Like, I would imagine. I was thinking about that today. And I was listening to the dead cross. It's like, it's gonna hurt to do these vocals sometimes, like when you're just screaming.

Michael Crain: 27:15

I don't know for him. I can't speak for him. But I know when I scream it hurts. I can't do that very long. But he's also he's also Mike Patton. So true. There's that?

Chuck Shute: 27:29

Yeah, like I mean, I know like Steven Tyler can still sing pretty pretty on point and he's getting up there in age and he still sounds pretty good. So there's some people were just freaks and those

Michael Crain: 27:38

guys Yeah, some of those guys man. Fucking great at it. Definitely. Yeah.

Chuck Shute: 27:46

Yeah. Cool. All right. Well, dead cross two. It's out. The album is on now. I believe right. And vinyl copy of it, too. Or hardcopy? Yeah,

Michael Crain: 27:55

everything. Okay. Cassette, CD, vinyl digital.

Chuck Shute: 28:01

Very cool. Well, yeah, I'll put the website in the show notes. Oh, and then is there a charity that you want people to donate to if they have some extra money after they buy your album?

Michael Crain: 28:10

Anything that helps dogs?

Chuck Shute: 28:13

Dogs? Yeah, I know. You've mentioned that. That's kind of been another saving grace. Besides music has been having dogs that helps with your like mental health helps you deal with the world. I think you said Yeah.

Michael Crain: 28:23

Yeah. Yeah. That's true. Okay, they bring you they they give you a perspective. You know, they, they keep it real simple. That's the best way to put it, you know?

Chuck Shute: 28:35

Yeah, absolutely. No, I feel the same way. I'm a cat person. But yeah, I have a cat. It's just It's where I never had. I never pets grown up. I wasn't allowed to. And then I got a cat. And I was like, Oh, this is what people talk about with pets. Like, I didn't understand it until I had one myself. It's kind of cool. Yeah. Very cool. All right. Well, thanks so much. I appreciate it. You bet later. Okay. Thank you again to Michael crane. The new album is dead cross two. It's really interesting stuff. Check it out on streaming or grab a physical copy to like, and as always, your likes, shares and comments on YouTube and social media. Help out the show and the guests so that more people see it and are aware of the episode and what the guest is promoting. So I appreciate all your support with that stuff. Also, make sure you're subscribed to the show. If you haven't already. I have some really interesting guests lined up that you're not gonna want to miss. So, thank you for your support. Have a great day and shoot for the moon.