David Ellefson (ex Megadeth, The Lucid, Ellefson-Soto)

David Ellefson is a musician, songwriter and author. He was the bassist of Megadeth from 1983 to their breakup in 2002, and then again from 2010-2021.  He has had a number of other musical and non-musical projects including the band The Lucid, the movie Dwellers, the book Rock Star Hitman and his own coffee company. His latest project is a collaboration with singer Jeff Scott Soto titled Ellefson-Soto. We discuss the new album, Megadeth soundtrack songs, his thoughts on the Pantera reunion and how he deals with his critics.

00:00 - Intro
00:53 - Studios & Arizona Musicians
04:12 - Ellefson-Soto Record & Andy Martongelli
10:35 - Jeff Scott Soto's Voice
13:38 - Songwriting & Bass Lines
17:35 - The Monkees & MTV
22:55 - Megadeth in Apple Commercial
23:50 - Soundtrack Songs
27:35 - Opening for Aerosmith
30:15 - Metallica & 99 Ways to Die
32:05 - Paranoid & Black Sabbath
33:15 - Pantera, Van Halen & Molly Hatchet
37:46 - Branching Out
44:14 - Dealing with Trolls & Critics
46:25 - Best Interviewer?
48:25 - MusiCares
49:30 - Outro

David Ellefson website:
https://www.davidellefson.com/

MusiCares website:
https://www.musicares.org/

Chuck Shute website:
http://chuckshute.com/

Transcript

Chuck Shute: 0:00

David Ellefson longtime Megadeth bass player is back on the show. We got a lot to talk about. Last time he was here he came with drew his partner in the band, The Lucid and also they worked together on the movie dwellers. Those projects have all come out now he's since left Megadeth and he has a new project that he just dropped with Jeff Scott Soto called Ellison Soto. They have a new album out called vacation in the underworld, very cool album title, and we discussed the new album. We talked about some old Megadeth stories. And I asked him something that I've been wondering is just what does he think about all the trolls that comment on literally any Blabbermouth article that comes out? Does he think that's funny? Well, we'll have an answer for you coming right up

Charles Shute: 0:52

and that's cool. What is that? Kate what's Karam studios?

David Ellefson: 0:58

King Richard Richard Easterling who goes by King Richard. He has a studio up in Colorado Springs. He's done a ton of stuff for me as a fantastic mix will make Jen recording engineer Sorry, I got stuff all over. And, and has a cool t shirt. So yeah,

Charles Shute: 1:19

you have a studio in Arizona. The record that

David Ellefson: 1:23

you're looking at it, you're looking at it as my laptop. But I do have one I record at my friend John Aquilino. Who known from the band icon from back in the 80s. He's got a fantastic studio. He's got a he built a studio on his property. 30 feet underground. It's like at least a two $3 million studio with a full SSL room and everything and then he just bought up brought over there's five of these big focus right consoles that they made some time back and he bought brought the one over front that was in South Africa. I think by way of the people with Post Malone helped him get the thing over here so that when you saw when I put up on my Facebook and I was recording some Dyess tracks there, they look like a spaceship. That's that's the studio. That's the upstairs room and then the downstairs room is the SSL room. So he's so he's officially got the Focusrite room upstairs and then downstairs is the platinum underground. So maximum camera. Yeah, see Arizona. Yeah. Made in Mesa here. Yeah. So sacred right. Sacred Rock record. She's done a few things. But Max and Igor, were my neighbors here. A few minutes away. So yeah, we do all kinds of stuff there. Oh, I

Charles Shute: 2:49

didn't realize how many people on airs. I know why Lisa had him on the show. And he rehab burger.

David Ellefson: 2:56

Yeah, people just fantastic. Yeah, he he landed Well, you know, after I guess the sacred rake yours kind of wound down for a while he Yeah, his place is great. He's he's got a couple. Make a couple of those restaurants are super good. Super good. So yeah, he's more than a burger flipper. And he's more than a musician. He's very well with that.

Charles Shute: 3:18

I think I just saw he's touring like Europe or something. They're doing really well.

David Ellefson: 3:23

Yeah, yeah. Yeah, they're back on. Yeah, they cut their record, they actually cut the record and John's place. And the guitar player, the new guitar player actually played on my Ellison Sleeping Giants record. He, he played some stuff I wrote better than I could play it. We bumped the templates up, and it was pretty rough. And so I was like, Okay, I could write this stuff. We need to get a guy in here who can like play this stuff? And asleep, you know, young guys. And it's funny how a lot of the stuff we were doing in the 80s and early 90s, you know, was was hidden hidden away wall, you know, hitting the speed limit, you know, but now dudes in their bedroom and like, you know, bedroom shredders on YouTube that like, play circles around what we used to do, you know, so the advancement of even human technology, you know, yeah.

Charles Shute: 4:11

This was this current record that Elson Soto was supposed to be a solo record, right. But then you, you had Jeff sing on and you're like, oh, we should just make this a band. Is that how it happened?

David Ellefson: 4:21

Well, yeah, I mean, again, I was I mean, it deservedly should be Ellefson Soto, obviously, both of our names, but you know, I was looking to start in early 2021. I was looking to start recording the next what I thought would probably be the next Ellison solo record. And hey, I'm always willing to share it, share the wealth share the credit, you know, and, and that's what I say deservedly. So, in fact, you should probably see Ellison Soto Martin jelly because Andy Mark jelly is the, you know, he's the third Beatle on this one for sure. You know, he's very much the kind of the energy center and he And I co write, you know, most of this stuff together. So, so Andy and I started writing and had a fair amount of material in motion. And you know, just considering, you know, vocal things, you know, Todd LaTorre is a buddy of mine sings and queens right, of course. And, you know, we were, you know, we had connected and we're talking about some stuff, and he actually has a terrific solo record on ratpack as well. And, and Andy just said to me, said, you know, why don't you? You know, why don't you just call Jeff, I just got zotoh. And you talk about him all the time. You love his voice, she gets her buddy. So I did. And it was it was just kind of that one moment in life where it just lined up. And of course, everybody was off the road, you know, with the quarantine and stuff. So it's a perfect time to do it. So yeah, that's, that's how it began. Sort of flush itself out from

Charles Shute: 5:57

there. Yeah. So you met Jeff through Alpha trollee, who was in Megadeth at one time and then but how did you meet Andy? Where did you find him? Because he Yeah, the guitar was amazing. So as the drums to Paulo is

David Ellefson: 6:08

great. I met Andy through Kiko actually, and I knew of Andy because I saw stuff of him online and as so I, you know, he caught my attention really freaking good. And I seem to think so I guess was on the dystopia tour we played in Bologna and the funny thing is is Cobra page from Cobra and the Lotus we had done a metal AllStars couple of shows together in South America so we became friends and her mom I think kind of basically manage manages her so her mom hit me and said, Hey, we need a guitar player for some stuff coming up and I was on the bus was good because it Do you know, anyone who said yeah, my friend Andy Martin jelly, let me hit him right now. I'm coming to the show tonight. So you know, it's just funny how life these these things work, you know? And so I met Andy that night in Bologna, and super great dude, awesome energy, obviously fantastic guitar player has great rock and roll sensibilities about him. So that's so you know, I hooked them up with he was out with Cobra and the Lotus there for not only a year or so, and we stayed in touch and then when Frank bello and I did when we did our dates with slash we're doing the altitudes and attitude records. So that was what 2000 What was that? 19 1819? I think right. Um, I needed a right here. Yeah, I think I think it was 19 so I needed a band aid. Today, it was 19. So I hit end, you know, not know, knowing he has got a lot of, you know, vivacious ferocious energy. I said, Can you play this stuff? This is a little bit more. This is kind of more YouTube meets, you know, Rem or something. Joe Jackson, you guys, no problem, brother. And then I discovered, you know, what a great singer Andy is and, and so, you know, from from there, that's when he and I started working on the Ellison Sleeping Giants records a couple months later, and he put together you know, he put together a terrific band, with Paolo, the drummer and then his friend Valaria on guitar. So you know, it's great with Andy because it's a plug and play thing that he can really call him the musical director if I need something say hey, I need a band here to the dates can we put this together and he'll just go just no problem brother. I got an handles you know, and he'll plug and play and I would just show up and plug in my bass and they're rehearsed and ready to go. So you know it's it's fun to have these these kind of musical Brotherhood's and you know, like that that works. So yeah, he's he's a one man. You know,

Charles Shute: 8:54

does he help out with the songwriting or is it all written by you and Jeff?

David Ellefson: 8:58

No, no to Andy for sure. Yeah, he the three of us pretty much wrote everything under okay, you know, in fact sharpen the sword was music that Andy brought in. And then Jeff and I collaborated on the lyrics you know, things like the reason that was pretty much all that was all Andy wrote all the music to that and then Jeff and I, Jeff to actually did Jeff and Andy did most of the lyrics on it. I did, I did some that kind of work a little bit on the chorus and some melodies and stuff. So yeah, it's it's fun to be collaborative, you know, and just kind of say, hey, it's all for one one for all, you know, let's, you know, like Jeff said, he goes, I always loved in the back of the Van Halen mountains where it says All songs written by Van Halen, you know, you know, you just kind of tick, tick, tick, that sort of squabble of who's gonna get the credit, who's gonna get the money and all that crap, just like that. Just take that off the table. You know what I mean? It just like say, hey, it's brand new. We're all in it together. Let's see what we come up with. And, you know, that's, that's a great place to start because then you kind of get that whole agenda off the table, you know? And then that and I like it to be like that i That's that to me always brings about the best music brings about the best heartfelt contributions people I want people to to to happily bring their best to the table not go well I bring this but you know really it's my song and if they're not going to pay me for it and I'll keep it for something over here you're not any because that's what starts to happen when you you don't think about it like that but it's you know when you're gonna get money and credit and all this stuff so I like kind of just get that thing off the table and sort of address that upfront. And then you know, make it an offer one kind of thing.

Charles Shute: 10:35

That's cool. I didn't realize like when I'm listening to this how diverse adjust voice can be like on some of the songs, he because I remember him from like, in Vietnam seen more of a screamer. And some of the songs sound like some of them sound more gritty, kind of like a James Hetfield. And then one something to nothing. He almost says like a philan SILMO, like Panthera scream. I'm like, he's got like five different voices. It's amazing.

David Ellefson: 11:01

Yeah, he really does know, I know it. He totally does. And I love that about him. Is he's he does, you know, and that's why I'm pretty much anything Andy and I would throw over to him. You know, we started with writing on the wall. And I think we sent over sharpen the sword. And then we sent over a couple more, and it was kind of like, I don't really want to try this when you want to try that one. When did this one, you know, it's and, and everything. He said back, we're just like, Jesus is so good man. And that's it even said, he goes, Man, this is like, so easy. It's like everything I send you guys, you guys like, and we're like, Listen, you know, we're we're working with you, because we like you, you know, we already like voice, you're a cool guy, you're a great presence, you know, you've got a big presence on these recordings. And, you know, it's, you know, let's do more, let's just keep at it. And man, I mean, really, over the course of a couple of months, we had like 15 songs done. And, you know, you kind of it's funny when you're writing like this, because if the ideas keep coming, you just you just keep the floodgate open man and just let the rivers flow, you know, and then you kind of know, when you sort of the stream kind of dries up and you go, Okay, I think, look, we got 1516 songs, Robert many was and it's like, Well, that certainly makes for a great record. Now we're gonna now we have the the luxurious problem of trying to decide which ones are going to go on the album, because they're not all gonna fit right as CDs, what 44 minutes, you know, vinyl is 28 or 32, or whatever, you know what I mean? So you start kind of figuring that out. And of course, now online, but the digital streaming services, we got to put everything up there. So you know, it's it was, you know, as far I worked with Chris Collier, the engineer who makes the record, he and I spent a lot of time going through the the running order and, and he said the same thing. Like we he'd mix a track and you go, man, he goes, I think this is my new favorite song, it makes another one he goes, Man, I think this is my new favorite song. So it's like, you know, it was fun to have a guy who wasn't. And this is why you usually hire an outside mixer, because they're not as sort of married to the demo and sort of the process. They're kind of a fresh, fresh perspective comes in. Alright, let me sit back in here. So I appreciated his fresh years, you know, to get some perspective and go man, I think this works. I think they all work. I don't know if the piano ballad out of the blue out of the blue. I don't know if that's gonna fit on here as great of a song as it is. So maybe we set that over here digital, and you know, so it's, you know, it's, it's, it's, you know, but there was a place for everything. And I think that was beauty of the record.

Charles Shute: 13:37

I think it's really a eclectic, yeah, I like that. There's different kinds of styles and music. I feel like there's like old school metal. And then yeah, you have the piano ballad. And, and you have like, what's the one song that was more like a progressive song? I forget which one that was. But I love to that. Is it fun that you're able to put in all these cool baselines, like on rise to when you kind of have the jazzy baseline? And then the day before tomorrow? So it's really cool baseline like, you probably weren't allowed to do that as much in Megadeth, I'm guessing.

David Ellefson: 14:05

No, no, not at all. And if it wasn't, you know, yeah, let's put it this way. All ideas are welcome. And, you know, it doesn't have to be sometimes you get in certain situations. Like, if it wasn't his idea, it's not a good idea, you know, one of those kinds of things. So, you know, and again, some things can be skewed by that it's like, hey, you know, is this really are we really discerning the best ideas? Or is it kind of filtered through? Well, if it wasn't my idea, it's not a good idea. So you know, it was nice to be sort of off the leash if you will, and set free to go you know, roam roam free, you know, and and to see what's there and I think, look at this point, we've all made enough records between me and Andy and Jeff and we've got good sensibilities to you know, in a way you you kind of learn to edit yourself a little bit, you kind of go, Yeah, this is pretty cool, but it's not right for this record. or, which can happen a lot when you're younger and you're making your first records because everybody just kind of wants to prove themselves. And, you know, it's a tough thing sometimes for your ego, you know, to be told, Hey, man, good, good, good song not right for this, you know, you got to take it over there. And so I think in any musical situation, you've got to be the have to have some self honesty about that, you know, I brought tracks into Megadeth over the years, and I knew we're good songs. And I also knew go, I don't know if this is going to be right. I mean, I remember I brought one in you know, if you were God, which I put on sleeping giants that I had John Bush singing the demo, which made it to sound even more awesome. And I remember I brought it in and euthanasia sessions and, and, and it was cool. I think, I think we even learned it and played it a little bit. It was kind of part of their first round of songs. Remember, Max Norman came in and because man, it's got this kind of Billy Idol groove to it. And you know, man, it's good song. And I don't know if it's right for the record. And I had to take that opinion as as, as some truth, you know, to go, Okay, it's a starting point, we've got a pile of initial songs. Now let's go write 12 more. And then when we sit back, we'll listen to everything that we have. I mean, there's some other songs like crown of thorns, or crown of worms, or whatever it was, and a few things that didn't go on the record, you know, they ended up becoming besides and things and, you know, so not everything you write is going to make the grade, which is why I think it's good to always write extra material, you know, but as for you're right, it's for like, the Bass Licks and stuff. It was cool, man, I mean, I pulled out my, I've got this cool old fender fretless jazz. And I was just, I pulled that out to play some of those licks, you know, so you can do some of the sliding, you know, kind of cool things. I used one of my think it was the Fred Jackson, you know, and my modulus base too, I think cuttings, shredding some wax. So it's fun to kind of put them all together and create this sort of little bass symphony at the beginning of the song. And it's a double handed some double handed tapping, descending, saying that the Buddha did it, you know, and really do some, you know, Stanley Jordan kind of stuff, you know, some really rip and overhand fretless and put a bunch of stuff and I figure, you know, it's as if it's going to be my record to have my names on it. Fucking I'm going for it. You know, it looks like you guys are totally, totally 100%. Man.

Charles Shute: 17:33

I didn't either the there's a song that's only on the European one. I'm not your stepping stone. You did a cover of that. I was intrigued. I couldn't find it, though.

David Ellefson: 17:43

I know. I, I you know, I let Joe and ratpack kind of make the executive decision on that. Because what we had two covers, you know, we had sorts of tequila, which is what we sort of launched, you know, a, an initial partnership with me and Jeff, while we were working on the record, we'd launched that and we even agreed to so now this will be kind of a way to kind of run run up the flagpole and see if people like it, and people seem to love it. They they thought we sounded great together. So that was kind of the, you know, Wayne's World. Thumbs up like, it's good. Keep going, you know. But, yeah, it's a stepping stone that just hit me one day. And it's funny because I was a big monkey's fan. I wasn't really so much of a Beatles fan. I was a monkey's fan. And somebody's age. Yeah, totally. That makes sense. Yeah. By the time I started listening to music, I mean, look, the Beatles came out with 6364 I was born 64. So I mean, you know, their explosive seven years. I mean, I missed it. I didn't start listening. And my mom had a Beatles record. So I heard it and I liked it. But, you know, I didn't do the deep dive on the Beatles so many years later in my life. I mean, you know, I started listening to music around the mid early mid 70s. By then the Beatles were over. But you know, the monkeys were on on Morning. Morning TV for me, you know, so I would watch that. And, and, you know, then reading, you know, it's funny. Christian Nesmith, who is Mike Nesmith son. Christian became a good friend of mine he was he and Nick Menza were best friends. So random. Yeah, random Yeah. So Kirsten and I became good friends and and so he would tell me you know, store I'd asked me to do what is it like going to hang out with your dad on the set when you're filming The Monkees. He goes Dude, it was so boring. You know it goes it's to show so it's like you set up you do a take next set up take it you know, I mean, so we see a TV show we see it all spice together. He said it goes he goes and I was just a kid. It was super boring. I think he's my age. So he was you know, just a young kid at the time. But you know Nesmith, I think went on to go. Start MTD and I read a really great article about him because of It wasn't like Guitar World magazine or something that he was able to help launch MTV. Because Because whereas the Beatles didn't get the love of television. I mean, they had Ed Sullivan, of course, but they didn't get the real kind of love of television in the way the Monkees did just a few years later. Because their whole musical thrust of everything they did was because they had a TV show. So he put it together, wait a minute, if bands make videos or bands can be on TV, it can really help launch him hence, MTV, right? So he put this whole kind of get, again, just a matter of, we can't help the year were born, right. So who knows, like, you know, the year we're born, the age we are when things come across our path in life, and we're able to connect them and put them together. So that was, you know, I thought kind of a really cool backstory to MTV, and how he was one of the propagators of that.

Charles Shute: 20:58

Yeah, well, you guys had the theme song to the MTV News for the longest time, and you're obviously a huge part of MTV, do you like it better now, though, because, in one hand, the MTV era, they kind of pick the best music or what they thought was the best music to play. Now, you can put anything on YouTube. But then again, everything is on YouTube. So there's so much stuff to weed through and try to find the good stuff. What do you like better? Because you've had both eras.

David Ellefson: 21:23

You know, I thought MTV was cool. And you're right. I mean, you know, it's funny. Here's the funny thing, you know, for as much as that baseline got us I missed the whole thing because we were on tour during the whole time right? So people all these years later go Dude, it was like the feed them to be recruited, you know, that your baseline was always in our heads and, and I like it was, you know, you know, those are the years you know, Megadeth was on the road all the time. So we weren't sit around watching MTV, but I do remember the first time that we heard it. There was a band department that me Dave and Chris Poland lived in when we got her advance from Capitol it was over in Silverlake called it the ranch? It was this three bedroom apartment, right? And? And there was like, a Bowflex? Right. Remember those things? Right. You had a Bowflex? I think I'm like working on the Bowflex. Chris is in the kitchen. Right? There was like an open kitchen. He's doing the dishes. And we always had MTV on in the background on the TV on TV, right. And all of a sudden that, you know, MTV News, who you heard it here, right? Whatever, the tagline was stopped because dude, was that our song? And it's like, I don't know. I missed it, you know? And then then you'd wait. And then the next time it was like MTV News, and they do the DJ scratch. Right. So it's like, I don't know, maybe it wasn't, maybe it was a fluke, you know, and so it was funny how that just developed into Bob culture, you know, and who knows, I guess it was just a fan, you know, or somebody there was like, that's cool. That's a cool little baseline. We'll we'll use that as the as the hook. You know, you never know why these things you use. I mean, like the Megadeth you know, last last rites, love to death get used an Apple iPhone commercial a couple of years ago. And what are the chances that someone had Apple wherever they're whoever their advertising and marketing people are decided decided? I know a song we could use. Oh, yeah. What's the song? Killing Is My Business song one side a 1985. Loves? What is the random chance that that would ever end up on an Apple iPhone commercial? It's not the most commercially sort of, you know, laid out song but but it's vicious, you know, and it's super frickin violent. And it was fucking great, man. I mean, they've used it a ton. They used it during like during the Stanley Cup. So it was pretty good. It got a lot of airtime. So you know, you never know these random moments in life when they show up for you.

Charles Shute: 23:48

Well, there's other songs like I like the songs that you guys have on the soundtracks I think those are some of your best songs like go to hell on the Bill and Ted and angry again weren't that were they both nominated for Grammy are just one of them

David Ellefson: 24:01

angry again for sure was I can't remember Grammy knops

Charles Shute: 24:08

Yeah, it was written for the it was written later but was go to hell was that like a rejected song from rest in peace?

David Ellefson: 24:15

No, it was not uncommon to think I think angry again, and then 99 Ways to Die and

Charles Shute: 24:21

another one from us.

David Ellefson: 24:23

Yeah, Beavis and Butthead platinum record up here. Yeah, they, those were both Grammy nominations, for sure. It's funny how, you know, in between albums, we would do these, these, you know, these one off, you know, soundtrack songs that we would get hit up to do and they would get they'd have all this success and they were again, platinum records, Grammy nominations, I mean, you know, so it's just they filled the gaps you know, in between in between other records. So yeah, the Go to hell. It's funny because Tom Wally who has then since going on it'd be the president of Warner Brothers and but he was our a&r guy at Capitol when we got signed to Capitol Records. And Tom got us our Nikes. He got us like this little Nike endorsement, some free shoes, which is why the P sells video which we recorded the love wars, we intentionally walk across the stage with our Nikes on because we're like, well, we use we should probably we should probably give a shout out back to Nike for giving us the free shoes. That's why we did it. Right. Guard is like the most obvious one. But then Tom went on to, he headed up Interscope Records. And I think he was at Interscope where he came to us, because He loved Megadeth. And you know, he was a big fan of ours. So even though he could work with us, he's when the opportunity came up for the soundtrack. He keeps people through our name in the hat right away, even though he wasn't even working at our label anymore. So he came, hit us up to do go to hell, because the name of the movie was going to be called Bill and Ted go to hell. And so we write the song. I remember, he came down to the enterprise studios. This point maximum, Norman was working with us it was during the rest in peace tour, actually. And we shot the video on the clash of the titans store in Chicago. And but I remember Tom came out of the studio, and he was working with Dave on the lyric. And he just said, Man just be as frickin dark and gnarly and satanic as possible. Really, please, thing, like, you know, my only friend as a girl was six exists between his words, you know what I mean? And so yeah, we work together, we that was actually I think, a group collaboration. On some level, the four of us worked, you know, it was cool, because the band was working really well together at that time. So we were trying to be collaborative. And, and then, of course, they changed the title of the movie at the last minute, I guess, they did some test marketing on it, you know, because they there's a lot that goes in before movies come out, they don't just randomly come out, you know, they do these sort of these, these, these, the name escapes me, but these little kind of theaters where they, they screening theaters, you know, where they do little screenings, and they'll bring, you know, 10s 10s and 20s of people in to get their opinions. And they, you know, they've spent a lot of money on marketing this thing. So I found out to go to hell, I guess was not so well received. So they changed it to Bill and Ted's Bogus Journey. And of course, by that time, you know, we'd already mixed and mastered and turn the song and so go to Hell is a better name. At least for

Charles Shute: 27:29

it. Yeah, I think so. I love that song, too.

David Ellefson: 27:32

I didn't realize this journey. Yeah,

Charles Shute: 27:34

I like those movies. Did you guys read this today? I don't I don't remember this. Because I remember I was a big Megadeth fan in the 90s. You guys actually opened for Aerosmith for a few shows. And you were going to do a full tour, but then it didn't work out. What was that? Like? That seems like an odd mix.

David Ellefson: 27:50

Yeah, it was very, it was suggested to us because it was a sobriety tour. Which is never the reason to make never make decisions on that. It's like if you need to get sober go home gets over a contract together. And then when you're ready to go work, go work. You know, that's that. Yeah, that was really unfortunate. Because I mean, look, we're Gerald Smith fans, I mean, who has, especially for me Toys in the Attic. That was my record, you know, probably the first three records in particular, so and of course live bootleg. So I'm a huge fan. And so you know, it was cool to go out. But obviously Aerosmith was in a very different phase. I mean, they were the big MTV stars, you know, they it was this more kind of pop version of Aerosmith, you know, during pong and get a grip and all that stuff. So yeah, you know, cool idea, not the reality of it was not well mixed, well matched, you know. And it was funny because I remember we were doing, we had an opportunity. We had gone out and done some shows it was negative Panthera White Zombie, who had just come on the scene and talk about MTV. I mean, Beavis and Butthead. Were just balling them up, you know, I mean, making them huge, you know, so, that opportunity we had and then got squandered as a result, because really, we gotta get to the Aerosmith tour. And we even Robert did some stadium shows with Metallica. They were at the end of the Black Album. This was 93 Right? So they'd been out like three years back the name of the tour was nowhere else to Rome. They were in like Far Eastern Europe. I mean, just vague playing every you know, dark you know, I mean, I remember there was this it was either Slovenia or Slovakia moment, Slovakia I mean, the country had just become a country in like January of 1993 that year, and they still had checklist Avakian money with like, the Slovakian stamp on it, right it like it was so new just come out from the you know, the, the Iron Curtain, you know, this is all those transitions are happening. And of course, you know, Metallica, we're always you know, going into these far reaches and doing stuff and even they're like, why don't you stay over here and stay on tour with us? You know, so we're like now we gotta go and do the Aerosmith tour. And I think we literally played two shows and they sent us back like it. It was not a good it was not a good fit. Yeah, so

Charles Shute: 30:15

we're with Metallica, you I didn't realize that you guys were still friends with them. During this whole I thought there was like this feud in the 80s and 90s. But no, I heard you say Lars used to come to your guys's shows all the time. He was still a fan.

David Ellefson: 30:28

Totally Yeah, I swear to God we were over doing those shows. And then they he asked us why don't you steagle Aerosmith. Why are you doing that? One stay over here. The record shows Metallica, the cult, and then Megadeth and suicidal tendencies with with Robert trio playing bass and ironically Jimmy Grasso on drums it was that version of of suicidal you know, which is kind of the more metal era of suicidal you know, but it would be great bills. I mean, they're huge. I mean, you know, Buddha passed the stadium and move past big stuff so yeah, he was kind of unfortunate you know, because then once we did the Aerosmith you know, again two shows we go home, but that was when we did we went in the studio and we did 99 Ways to Die. We had to go to the studio to do 99 ways to basically for the beaver some was that yeah

Charles Shute: 31:28

yeah, it was around the same time

David Ellefson: 31:31

angry again we did earlier that sorrow or maybe in the spring. Yeah. And that was for the Arnold Schwarzenegger movie for Last Action Hero so yeah, really. We did go to hell and 91 Last Action Hero was kind of spring of 93. And then we did 99 Ways To Die For Beavis and Butthead. We did that in fall, kind of late summer, late summer, I guess of of 93 after the Aerosmith debacle there and at the same time we did paranoid which I think that got nominated for Grammy FC memory serves me reserves right. That's right. Yeah. Activity and yeah, I was doing Yeah. Cuz Sabbath was not, you know, they were in this kind of fragmented, almost non existent era, you know. And because Ozzy would come back to the band in 98, and I remember we played here in Phoenix with the big where the Diamondbacks play the big baseball stadium. It's brand new. And yeah, Chase Field is brand new, and we were the first concert to ever play there. And it was New Year's evil. So Black Sabbath was you just come back to Sabbath, which was huge, you know, so and Bill Ward, so it was the original Sabbath. Panthera last time I saw up in turquoise, actually, because I think they disbanded kind of right after that. Megadeth Slayer sold why? So it's pretty, pretty frickin New Year's evil kind of evil.

Charles Shute: 33:08

That's very cool. And, yeah, I was gonna ask you about that because they they're having a reunion of sorts. I mean, obviously, they've replaced, they got Zakk Wylde and Charlie Benante on drums. I think it's really cool. I was a big Pentair fan. I saw them live a couple times. I mean, it's the original singer. So the the vocals are gonna sound good. And I mean, you can't replace the guitarist and drummer but if you're gonna have somebody step in, I mean, those are two great names. So what are your thoughts on that?

David Ellefson: 33:36

You know, look, I just went did kings a Thrash? Right. We played early songs that people haven't heard in many years may not ever hear again. If someone doesn't like us doesn't go play them. People love them. You know what I mean? They love them. There's some original members in the organization. So they love it. So yeah, I mean, look, there's no replacing diamond Beatty, I mean, on one level, Pan Tara as pan Tara with the brothers that mean that that's, that's set in stone, never to be replicated to get and can't. It's like Van Halen. You know, it's after watching Wolfgang play at the Taylor Hawkins thing. I think me and probably a few people went, Wow, if there could ever be a Van Halen reunion, he would be the guy to go play the Eddie Van Halen role right? I mean, he's Eddie son. He's phenomenal. He's his name is Van Halen. You know if he and the uncle could make it work with Alex I mean to me, man, if they could do Wolfgang Alex bring Michael llanthony back. They can frickin get whatever singer they want it to be done with the singer debacle. And it's I mean, come on those three. That's you know, I mean, because to me, Michael Anthony was as much of the sound of Van Halen with his singing as anything was so you know what I mean? So these moments happen like this. I think regarding pan Tara I mean, Charlie's, he's, he's one of the best in the business, you know, and a great dude and keeps his head down, keeps his mouth shut. And he's, he's, he's, he's, he's just he's a man on a mission. I can't say enough great about the guy. And I think Zack, you know, you can almost see a common I mean, if there's ever going to be there's no heir to the throne, if you will, for Dimebag because he's, it's a throne uniquely his own. But if there was ever anyone who could go out and do that justice, it would be Zack. And I think that's kind of a thumbs up from everybody on that one. So, you know, look, people want to hear the songs at the end of the day, they want to hear the songs, you know, and like you said, the voice is still there. You know, Rex, you know, he's, he's, he's an original member, so why not? Try it? Yeah,

Charles Shute: 35:52

I mean, I've seen bands reunite with a lot less members. And they go as long as it's like, you know, the drummer or something. That's the only original member. It's a complete different band, but they still use the name. So

David Ellefson: 36:03

yeah, yeah. Yeah, no, it's funny. When I worked at PD, there was a guy who bought the Molly Hatchet name. And I was a Molly Hatchet fan growing up right flooded with disaster and stuff. And and so he called me up one day, and he said, Hey, man, I want to order 2451 50 cabinets, because we're going to Europe. And I asked him, I said, How does this work? is like, because I know Danny Joe Brown, the singer, I think died. They said, as Dave Lubeck there and the guys goes, Man, he goes, I bought the name. They all cashed out, I bought the name. I own the name so I can go out and only touch it says, God bless you. Yeah. Wow. So, you know, Stranger things have happened. I mean, I guess, you know, it's, you learn the music business at that point, especially legacy stuff. It's it kind of is that, you know, but But you're right. I think as a fan for me, I don't want to just see a corporate cash grab, you know, I want to I want to hear and feel it being authentic. I want to I want to see it be authentic. Because let's face it, you know, people listen with their eyes, too. You know, they want to they want to see it's, you know, I was using example cheap trick when I go see cheap trick. You know, I want to see Robin Zander and Rick Nielsen. And, you know, for me, Tom Peterson, a bunny Carlos, that's no longer but you know, it's it's as much as you can I want to see some original guys up there. You know, Jean and Paul. I mean, to me, that's, that's, that's a it's a good start. I wish all four of them were there. But the reality isn't that, you know, so. So, you know, I'm a fan too. So I have the same opinion as other people. Yeah.

Unknown: 37:40

Do you have time for a few more questions? Or

David Ellefson: 37:42

do you gotta get going? Got a couple more, and then I gotta wrap up. Okay. Yeah,

Charles Shute: 37:46

cuz I do want to ask you, like, when you talk about the business side, I want your take on that. Because, you know, you mentioned how you knew you're not gonna put your eggs all in one basket after the first time. Megadeth disbanded. So you're like, I'm gonna have all these other projects. And you've, you've stayed true to that. And so what is your advice for doing that, though? Because like, I'm trying to branch out all I have right now is this podcast. I'm like, I gotta get some other things. Every podcaster I know, is either they do comedian or they're a musician or million other things. So how do you branch out without losing? You know, your your strength of like, if you were just doing one band? Would you be focusing on that? What if the band isn't as good? If you're doing other things? Do you lose some some of the cachet?

David Ellefson: 38:27

Well, good, great question, actually. And, you know, when, when people come to me, and they say, with any suggestions for young musicians, it's like, well, first of all, take lessons, learn music, don't just learn guitar or bass, like learn music, learn the language of music, you know. And play with as many people as you can, because it will broaden your horizons, you'll start to learn about the language of music. Now, when you're coming at it as a professional, and you start to decide, okay, I'm going to, you know, become, you know, a name, I want to make a living doing this, okay? Now you need to really focus, you know, now you need to strip all that other stuff away, and you need to focus in and usually, you know, the best path forward is to, you know, have a group, if you will, and and have that group have some success, you know, it's a name, it's a brand. It's the collaboration, everything for me, you know, 20 years and Megadeth, I'd made a name for myself, you know, I stayed true to that. I was only one group was a founder and owner, you know, I stayed true to that one mission. I didn't see it ending, you know, unknowing at any minute. Good, you know, because that's where our bands are. But, you know, I didn't see it ending and one day that happened. And so I was like, Okay, now I have to reassess things because that gig is off the table. It was not a temporary side car. It was a disbanding, it's over. Done. So I was like, Well, I'm not gonna sit around and wait for that. I gotta get moving on and some people approached me about playing in their bands. I had not I had no experience with it really. So I kind of didn't know how to handle it. My friend out, Petrelli was there as a buddy, because he had just gotten done doing a lot of Sideman work with Alice Cooper, obviously, just recently, with Megadeth, he was pretty much full time with Paul O'Neill and Trans Siberian Orchestra. So that's, you know, that's where he went back to that because been his own. Now, for the last, you know, 2530 years. Like, if you can have a big gig, it's great, because it's the thing that which all the other things happen. So kind of having that one thing that you're known for, I think, helps, it's a good thing. For me, at this point, in my life, I will always be known as a negative guy, for sure. And I've been able to do some other things, you know, work with my friends and soul fly in ministry and do some things that were that were fun, it was kind of bucket list items, for me working with some of my buddies. Metal allegiance, hopefully, you know, got to make couple records with my friends. Even the Ellison no cover record, you know, during quarantine, and got to call a lot of my friends up who were were all out of work, we're all sitting in home says, Hey, you want to play in a record. And that expanded the horizons to do some other fun things. So, you know, now I'm in a season now where I, I, you know, a lot of things came out this year at same time, just because of kind of how the floodgates opened, post COVID. And those things are out now and, but I'm starting to now focus things in a little tighter, because I found a couple things that I'm really enjoying, they're, they seem to have success in their future. So I'm focusing on those now, you know, so, you know, I've gone through these narrow seasons, these wide seasons, and then focusing back into, you know, kind of laser focusing. So I think it's kind of, you just sort of got to be a little intuitive with it, you know, if a lot is coming to you take it man, you know, if, if one or two of those things starts to kind of pop, you know, pay attention to that, too. You know, and I tell Pete young musicians too, it's like, you know, when they're starting their bands, it's like, hey, breed the room, man. You know, if you're playing like we do with P cells, when we went out, we did a little tour for three weeks before we recorded the we knew when we started playing pizzelle that song was going to be a hit, you could feel it, you could just feel it in the room. Pay attention to that, you know, if if your stick if you play and people leave, you might want to think about what you're doing. If you play and people more people come in because they go wow, this is cool. Keep doing that, you know, so again, be don't be so insistent that I do this my art bro. And that's like, whatever, you know what I mean? I get that. But you know, you're not in the art business. You're in the music business. You know? You're in the entertainment business and you're selling the product. You know as soon as a guy Burbage anyone buys a concert ticket, it's a contract, it says, I pay you, you're going to entertain me, right? That's what it says, you know, that's the both written and unspoken rule of a concert ticket. You know, that's why they say rain or shine. And you know, you buy the ticket, because, you know, that's what's gonna happen. So, you know, and lots of times, it takes younger musicians to kind of get their mind around that. It's like, Man, when you step on the stage, it's a privilege. It's not a right. It's a privilege. So when you're out there frickin entertain the kids, man. Give the people what they want.

Charles Shute: 43:34

No, that makes sense. Because it's like, I feel like my podcast because I'll be like, I tried to do a eclectic mix of guests. And, you know, I'll try to have these really intellectual conversations with psychologists and sometimes those episodes don't do as well. Then I have the rock star. I'm like, okay, these ones do really well. I gotta do more of the rock stars like that's what the people want. So

David Ellefson: 43:54

once you troublemakers, what's gonna happen today, you know, tune in today, because that's what a lot of it is gonna be. There's, there's sort of rock bands, which is like, it's like tune in today to see what might blow up and you know what controversy might happen? And, you know, right wrong or a different man. That's sometimes that's that's what it is. I mean, again,

Charles Shute: 44:13

I was gonna ask you about that because I love personally, I just I love like blabber mouth and metal sludge. I love these sites. I think they're funny. They're fun. They make rock fun. I don't think rock should be taken too seriously. But there is a lot of trolls and stuff like that. Like I noticed even on interviews with you. What's interesting is, you know, some people troll you but some people troll Mustaine they'll say oh, like Dave Ellison's a good guy, Dave Mustaine is a jerk. And I'm just like, Oh, wow. Okay, like people just don't like anything like what is your thoughts? Do you find it sometimes kind of funny sometimes to like, I had this band plush. They're a female group. And they said somebody on Blabbermouth called them chicle back and they thought it was hilarious. Like, do you ever laugh at some of the comments that people say,

David Ellefson: 44:56

Dude, you have to laugh that I mean, first of all, I never read any of that stuff. So I just stay completely. I, you know, Tom Brady had a good thing somebody asked him, he said, Do you ever read the Monday morning quarterback? You know what they say about you goes God, no, it's like, I would never be able to play the game next week, because I'd be someone would be in my head. And you know, Jeff Young told me that, that, you know, maybe Ryan had the same things. And she goes, I'd never read the interviews. I've never read the press and never read anything about it. Because I don't want some fan or some critic, being in my head about what I should or shouldn't do in my next role, you know, because, and I thought that was great. It's like, to some point, you got to be a little detached from that stuff, you know, and it's just like, hey, man, I pick up my bass, I write a song, I call my buddies, we make an album. That's what it is, right? We put it out. You know, when you're making the album, it's your album. But once you put it out, it now becomes your album. And, you know, it's, of course, there's going to be critics, there's going to be those who you know, love or hate, you know, but I mean, look, I look at movies. I usually like most of the movies, the critics hate. I mean, it's like, I go see movies all the time. And it's like, you know, oh, the critics gave it about us. Like, I don't give a shit. I don't go into the movie with him. You know, I can care less what he says, you know, I'm going to have my own experience with it. Same with records. I put them on. Right by download him I put him on to have my own experience with you know, and you know, so? Yeah, I mean, it's in look at it. It is an entertainment business, man. So they all keep us entertained.

Chuck Shute: 46:25

Absolutely. Well, last question. I'll let you go here. I'm just curious because you've been interviewed by so many people from like magazines, I'm sure like circus and rip and all those things to radio stations, a podcast MTV, and Eddie trunk. I'm sure you've had been on his show, who is the best skill or most skilled interviewer that interviewer that you've dealt with?

David Ellefson: 46:45

You are dude. clip And that's, yeah, there you go. Just got right there. Yeah, that, you know, the reality of it is, is, you know, it's, again, it's a privilege when people want to talk to you, you know, like, you know, you get to talk to people, not you have to talk to them, you know, you get to go play shows, not, oh, I have to Blue show, and I'm not down to the musicians. You know, there's some people that it's like, they complain, they gotta go on the road, and then they get on the road, and they complain, they want to be back home. It's like, you're never happy, you know what I mean? So to me, you know, I'm just, I'm just doing this hoping I never have to go get a real job. And so far, it's worked out pretty good for the last 40 years. I, you know, I just, I just wake up and go, I don't know, let's see what's on the palette today or on the menu today, you know, and you know, and some of it is, you know, it's just, you know, you're, you're, you're engaging with, with the outside world and because a lot of creating, you're kind of in your own world. And even when you're on tour, you're kind of in your bubble, you know, use your yellow submarine, the tour bus, the airplane, whatever it is, and you're in your world and, you know, your worlds pretty small and tight to keep things to keep things together as you're rolling around the Earth. Playing music, you know, so this is it's all part of it, man. It's all part of the game.

Charles Shute: 48:09

All right, well, you have the new records out now. And then you have the lucid that's so active. You have the coffee company, you had the movie dwellers, so many things that also I always promote a charity you will still have the David Ellefson Youth Music Foundation. Is that still active? You know,

David Ellefson: 48:24

we did we did a lot with that. And especially when the Grammys had their chapter of that the Grammy they had the Grammy Music Education Coalition so they were really supportive that has since gone away during it didn't survive koban unfortunately, but I've remained friends with a lot of those people so I actually do some other charitable work with them now through other things as well. So I generally I generally tend to now I give most of my charitable givings I'll do through MusiCares Okay, helps musicians who are in need of of health care and things like that. So that's yeah, it's it's you know, those are like get like strong I don't need some some some of my strengths to them and they make jewelry and they get it's gonna get strong get strong back calm, I think is their was their, their domain. So they do a lot of that kind of stuff. And so I'll donate that money over there. Okay, back. Alright.

Charles Shute: 49:21

Well, thanks so much. I'll let you go. I know you get me to get going. So I appreciate you going a little over with me and great stories. Great stuff. Thank you so much, man. Thanks so much. David Ellison. What a legend. Again, his latest project project is called Ellison Soto features just got Soto and it's just an all around fun album. And he has so many other things to promote his other band elucid his coffee, his movie dwellers, the book that he wrote with Drew, Rockstar hitman. Check his website in the show notes for the latest news, follow him on social media and of course, your likes, shares and comments will help out the algorithm there and you can do the same to help me and the show. Just make sure that your comments are positive. Or if they're going to be negative at least make sure they're very funny. Thank you for supporting us have a great day and shoot for the moon.